EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes


Subject: EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes
From: Guy de Burgh (gdeburgh@camarillo.innoveda.com)
Date: Mon Oct 08 2001 - 17:42:56 PDT


DATE: 10/8/01

SUBJECT: October 5, 2001 EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes

VOTING MEMBERS AND 2001 PARTICIPANTS LIST:
3Com (& CommWorks) Roy Leventhal
Ansoft Corporation (Eric Bracken)
Apple Computer John Figueroa
Applied Simulation Technology [Raj Raghuram], Norio Matsui,
                               Fred Balistreri
Avanti (Chen Hongyu)
Cadence Design [Ian Dodd], Patrick Dos Santos, Heiko Dudek,
                               Lynne Green*, Lance Wang
Cisco Systems Syed Huq, Lungfu Chen
Cypress Semiconductor (Rajesh Manapat)
EMC Corporation Brian Arsenault, Jinhua Chen
Fairchild Semiconductor Adam Tambone
Huawei Technologies Rachild Chen
IBM Michael Cohen, Greg Edlund, Wes Martin,
                               Yeon-Chang Hahm, Bill DeVey, Pravin Patel
Innoveda (& HyperLynx) Guy de Burgh*, John Angulo*, Cary Mandel,
                               Matthew Flora, Steve Kaufer
Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Arpad Muranyi*,
                               Dave Lorang, Michael Mirmak, Qinglun Chen,
                               Will Hobbs, Wei-hsing Huang
LSI Logic Larry Barnes
Mentor Graphics Bob Ross*, Tom Dagostino*, Chris Reid,
                               Mike Donnelly*, Hazem Hegazy, Tony Dunbar,
                               Griff Derryberry, Dan Lake, Sherif Hammad,
                               Mohammed Korany, Weston Beal, Chris Swaim,
                               Ali Samii, Eric Ronger, Karine Loudet,
                               Daisaku Shiga, Kenji Kushima, Ian Dodd
Micron Technology Randy Wolff*, Yong Phan*, Tim Wells*
Mitsubishi Pat Hefferan
Molex Incorporated Gus Panella, Brian O'Malley
Motorola (Rick Kingen)
National Semiconductor Milt Schwartz*
NEC Corporation (Akimoto Tetsuya)
North East Systems Associates Edward Sayre
Philips Semiconductor Zack Ciccone, Rob Mataheroe
Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham)
Siemens (& Automotive) AG Bernhard Unger, Helmut Katzier,
                               Katja Koller, Wolfram Meyer, Eckhard Lenski,
                               Gerald Bannert, Burkhard Muller,
                               Christian Marot, Manfred Maurer,
                               Amir Motamedi, Hans Pichlmaier
Signal Integrity Software Douglas Burns, Barry Katz, Walter Katz
Sigrity Raj Raghuram, Winson Yu
SiQual Scott McMorrow, Rob Hinz, Bernard Voss,
                               Chris Brewster
Texas Instruments Thomas Fisher, Stephen Nolan, Ramzi Ammar,
                               Jean Claude Perrin, Moshiul Haque
Time Domain Analysis Systems Dima Smolyansky, Steve Corey
Tyco Electronics (Russell Moser)
Via Technologies (Weber Chuang)
Zuken (& Incases) John Berrie, Ralf Bruening

OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 2001:
Actel Corporation Silvia Montoya
Acuson Kim Helliwell
AMCC Jeff Smith
ASIS Ltd David Wright
Brocade Communications Robert Badal
BMW Friedrich Hasinger
Cereva Networks Bob Haller
Compaq [Peter LaFlamme], Ron Bellomio, Quang Dam,
                               Bill Ham
EADS Airbus Industry Claude Huet
  (Aerospatiale)
EFM Ekkehard Miersch, Horle Raines
EIA Cecilia Fleming
Ericsson Radio Systems Anders Ekholm
FCI Sercu Stefaan
Foundary Networks Bertram Chan
Framatom Conectors Danny Morlion
Fraunhofer Institute Mariusz Faferko, Peter Kralicek
  Reliability and
  Integration
Fujitsu Ltd Tadashi Arai, Takeshi Murakami
Heidelberger Druchmaschinen AG Wolfgang Kleinfeldt
Hyundai Electronics Jongho Kang
Idaho State University Al Davis
Infineon Technologies Christian Sporrer
Intrinsix Corporation Steven Chin
KAW/USA Shinichi Maeda
National Institute of Applied Etienne Sicard
  Science (INSA)
Nokia Tapani von Ravner, Mika Castren,
                               Janne Uusitalo
North Carolina State U. Paul Franzon
Nortel Networks Calvin Trowell
Oak Technology Darmin Jin
Plexus Technology Group Joseph Socha
Sintecs Hans Klos
STMicroelectronics Peter Hirt, Fabrice Boissieres
Sun Adrian Udenze
Toshiba Corp. Hirokaza Kato, Yuichi Koga, Toshio Sudo
Xilinx Susan Wu

In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal
members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses.
Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets.

Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are
as follows:

  Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode
  October 26, 2001 1-916-356-2663 3 0776283

All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas
out 7 days before each Open Forum, and meeting minutes out within 7 days
after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted
by Stephen Peters and give the reservation number and passcode.

NOTE: "AR" = Action Required.

-------------------------------- MINUTES -----------------------------------

INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM
Tim Wells from Micron Technology is developing IBIS, EBD and Spice models
and is interested in learning more about IBIS.

MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT
Stephen Peters reported that Motorola and Siemens have rejoined and NEC has
joined the IBIS Open Forum. This increases the voting membership to 34.

Stephen reported that we are reviewing the budget for 2002.

REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S
The August 31, 2001 IBIS Minutes were approved without change. The
September 13, 2001 IBIS Summit Meeting Minutes were approved without
change.

The ARs were discussed during the meeting.

MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS
None

PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES
Stephen Peters reported that Roy Leventhal updated the IBIS Models page as
of September 6 and 12, 2001.

Bob Ross noted that Syed Huq and Cecilia Fleming updated the Support link
for the IBIS Model Review Committee, the Roster link and will update the
Upcoming Events Link.

NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE
Bob Ross reported that IBIS models can be found by searching for IBIS under
PLX Technology:

  http://www.plxtech.com

Several IBIS models now exist for Galileo Technologies under:

  http://www.galileot.com/products/internetworking/catalog.html

OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES
Milt Swartz asked about the number of participants expected at the
January IBIS summit meeting. This was covered under the agenda
item "Other Summit Meeting Plans".

INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS
- JEITA ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits
  (IMIC) - Bob Ross reported that the IMIC Link now has the published
  standard ED-5302 of March 2001 under:

    http://tsc.jeita.or.jp/eds/IOPG.htm

- IEC 62014-3 (ICEM) Integrated Circuit Electromagnetic Model Proposal
  (formerly, IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation) - Stephen Peters reported
  that a link to ICEM documentation including a preliminary ICEM Cookbook
  now exists under
     
    http://intrage.insa-tlse.fr/~etienne/Emc/index.html

  Bob Ross and Stephen participated by teleconference in a meeting held
  in Paris on Thursday, October 4, 2001. The ICEM working group reported
  that they now have a committee draft for vote (CDV) ready to send to
  the IEC for international approval. Stephen and Bob offered to review
  the ICEM proposal and provide feedback on syntax and IBIS compatibility.
  We expect a presentation on the ICEM progress at the January IBIS Summit.

  Bob also reported that EMC material including a more recent version of the
  ICEM documentation exists under

    http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/emc/

- JEDEC JC-16 - Modeling and Testing - No report.

- T10, Project 1414-DT - SCSI Signal Modeling (a Technical Committee of the
  National Committee for Information Technology (NCITS)) - No report.

PCB CONFERENCE EAST 2001 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING FEEDBACK
Stephen Peters requested feedback on the IBIS Summit Meeting on September
13, 2001 in Worcester, Massachusetts. Stephen noted that teleconferencing
had its disadvantages including not being on site and subject to other
meetings and interruptions. It is much better to be on-site and away from
the office.

Bob Ross stated that a number of presentations were successfully delivered
by teleconference. However, he missed being on site with the rest of the
group for more interaction.

Everyone felt that the meeting did go well. Stephen asked, and Bob
responded that all of the presentations including an Ad Hoc one by Arpad
Muranyi are now uploaded under:

  http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/summits/sep01/

OTHER SUMMIT MEETINGS PLANS
Stephen Peters reported on the plans for the IBIS Summit Meeting scheduled
on Monday, January 28, 2002 associated with DesignCon 2002 in Santa Clara,
California. We will an Associate Sponsor. A large meeting room and
refreshments will be provided. We will also plan on a booth, and Guy de
Burgh will be handling the arrangements. Innoveda will be providing
the backdrop. Milt Schwartz is handling the local arrangements and National
Semiconductor is sponsoring the lunch. Initial notices about the meeting
will be issued in early December 2001.

Milt asked for a preliminary head count of who will attend. All the IBIS
officers plan to attend. Milt expects about 40 people based on the current
economy.

Bob Ross reported that plans are underway for a European IBIS Summit Meeting
on Friday, March 8, 2002 associated with DATE2002 in Paris France. So far,
Mentor Graphics and Zuken are co-sponsors. More co-sponsors are requested.
As before, there will probably be a strong emphasis on EMC/EMI issues.

Bob added that we might consider teleconference connections at these
meetings because of the travel restriction uncertainty.

IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION
John Angulo still has not had a response regarding someone chairing the IBIS
Model Review Committee.

Bob Ross reported no new models, and John also has no models left to review.

MAJORDOMO UPDATE
John Angulo reported that IBIS Users activated in September. The email
archives are available under HTML formats with sorting through the following
symbolic links:

  http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/email_archive
  http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/users_archive

The actual archives are under:

  http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/email/email/
  http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/email/users/

We are still working on cleaning up unnecessary soft links and on archiving
some IBIS reflector e-mail. Actual text archives should be available under
the above directories as email.archive and users.archive. The text versions
preserve the original text white spaces that are lost under the HTML formats.

John Angulo reported that he is still dealing with mail archive issues.
IBIS reflector traffic is being archived into the HTML archives, but no
traffic have been entered into the parallel .txt archive since September
11. John noted that the ibis-users reflector archive is OK, and that a
permission problem with the IBIS reflector .txt archives was fixed. John
plans a further follow-up with the machine administrators.

John mentioned that the proper way to subscribe is by sending a message to
majordomo@eda.org and include in the body the text "subscribe ibis" or
"subscribe ibis-users". An e-mail address is optional, but would be added
if it is different from the sending address. The ibis-request@eda.org still
works, but may be phased out in the future.

CONNECTOR PROPOSAL REPORT
Stephen Peters reported that meetings were held September 4, then
again on Monday September 17 and Oct 1. There was no meeting on
Sept. 24. The committee has almost completed its initial review
of the connector specification, and a proposal has been put forth
regarding supporting both RLGC and S-parameter matrixes. Stephen
stated that the committee is still on track to release the .icm
specification for IBIS Open Forum review in the first quarter of
2002.

IBIS FUTURES REPORT
Stephen Peters reported that meetings were held on Sept 6, 20, 27,
and Oct 4. The committee has been focused on creating the IBIS-ML
language reference manual (LRM), and an updated draft version of
the LRM was issued Wednesday. The committee is currently reviewing
the syntax rules and guidelines chapter as well as simulation
primitives.

Stephen also reported that Al Davis has withdrawn from the IBIS
Futures committee. While the committee will miss his input, the
spec is still on schedule to be ready for general review by the
IBIS Open Forum at the end of January 2002.

BIRD72.1 - ACCOMMODATING PMOS AND NMOS//PMOS SERIES FET MODELS
Tom Dagostio stated that there were just editorial changes. The intent
of BIRD72.1 is to document that [Series MOSFET] devices for switches do
consist of NMOS and also NMOS in parallel with PMOS devices. There may
also be PMOS only devices. The writeup needs to be changed so that is
not NMOS specific. Furthermore the PMOS in parallel with NMOS devices
have non-monotonic I-V tables, so the related ibischk parser needs to
have the warning messages changed.

Bob Ross added that some of the text had been cleaned up. Also a sample
I-V table for a real device is added. It show some of the non-monotonic
behavior that Tom described.

Stephen Peters did not understand the new equation in the document. Tom
stated that both the PMOS and NMOS currents needed to be added. Bob noted
that the terms Idsp and Idsn were not defined. Also there still exists some
references to Vgs which need to be changed to Vtable since the discussion
also apples to NMOS in parallel with PMOS devices (with two gates).

AR - Tom Dagostino issue BIRD72.2 with further editorial changes by October
12, 2001 so that it can be considered for a vote at the next IBIS meeting.

BIRD73.1 - FALL BACK SUBMODEL
Bob Ross discussed revisions in the recently issued BIRD73.1. Bob spoke
first about the suggested changes to the Bus_hold portion. Based on the
August 31, 2001 meeting comments, the corrupted Bus_hold examples were
restored. The Off_delay entries in the example were changed to be in
alignment with the text. In particular, the Off_delay subparameter has
typ/min/max table entries by value since there is no process/temperature/
voltage correlation to changes. Finally the suggested state table showing
initial conditions and transitions was entered.

Bob discussed the new state table. He noted that in the original bus_hold
writeup the initial submodel state of low or high is based on Vdie voltage
values with respect to V_trigger_r and V_trigger_f. This left an ambiguous
gap if the Vdie value fell in between these values due to, for example, a
Thevenin terminator. So Bob made the initial submodel state to be set to
the state of the driver in the net being analyzed. This is usually
consistent with the original writeup, but also gives a known simulator
setting in the case where the Vdie voltage makes the submodel state unknown.

Bob also noted that one application would use Off_delay and only a [Pullup]
up table for a temporary rising edge "kicker" or Off_delay and only a
temporary [Pulldown] "kicker". A different initial state method is
documented. The submodel always is initialized in the "off" or High-Z
state. A [Pullup] would be initialize low, and a [Pulldown] would be
initialized high. BIRD73.1 is incorrect, and this needs to be fixed in
BIRD73.2.

A normal application might include switchable terminations (stronger than
just bus hold circuits). Usually two separate submodels would be
constructed so that each is initialized in the High-Z state for overall
bus low and high states. Lynne Green asked if the multiple output stages
that switch on and off can be modeled. Bob responded with yes by using more
submodels.

Bob stated that the Fall_back submodel changes had just a few editorial
changes for clarity. The submodel is initialized in the same state as the
driver in the net. This needs to be clarified. Bob will make more
editorial corrections and possibly review the technical writeup further.

AR - Bob Ross issue BIRD73.2 with editorial changes and with the Driver
restriction for further review and discussion.

IBISCHK3 BUG TRACKING STATUS
Bob Ross reported that Atul Agarwal has nearly completed the works for
fixing BUGs 48 - 56. He may not fix BUG55, but possibly fix BUG59. Bob
stated that Matthew Flora has a fix to BUG55 and also possibly BUG59.

We expect the ibischk3.2.8 to be available in October 2001. Bob described
that the executables need to be generated and uploaded and the source code
needs to be distributed to the companies that have source code licenses.

Lynne Green volunteered to produce a Linux executable. Bob suggested that
one also be produced for ibischk3.2.7.

XML FOR IBIS
Bob Ross introduced some work by Atul Agarwal regarding XML coding of IBIS.
This work will be uploaded in the future under:

  http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/xml/

Bob is waiting for a generic IBIS model example that can be uploaded with
the other material. The material will contain a work in progress
syntactical description of IBIS called ibis.dtd. An ibis.html file will
show the IBIS structure graphically.

Bob noted that the work differs from what Mike LaBonte presented at
the June 8, 2000 IBIS Summit Meeting. Atul's format stores all min/typ/max
data are all in the same data base, whereas Mike's proposal had them
separated.

Comments will be requested when the information is uploaded.
 

NEXT MEETING:
The next teleconference meeting will be on Friday, October 27, 2001 from
8:00 A.M. to 10:00 AM Pacific time. BIRD72.2 is scheduled for a vote.

============================================================================
                                      NOTES

IBIS CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-1831
            stephen.peters@intel.com
            Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation
            M/S JF4-215
            2111 NE 25th Ave.
            Hillsboro, OR 97124-5961

VICE CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897
            bob_ross@mentor.com
            Modeling Engineer, Mentor Graphics
            8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070

SECRETARY: Guy de Burgh (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259
            gdeburgh@innoveda.com
            Senior Manager, Innoveda
            1369 Del Norte Rd.
            Camarillo, CA 93010-8437

LIBRARIAN: Roy Leventhal (837) 797-2152, Fax: (847) 222-2799
            roy_leventhal@3com.com
            Senior Engineer, CommWorks Corp. (a wholly owned 3Com
            subsidiary)
            1800 W. Central Rd.
            Mt. Prospect, IL 60056-2293

WEBMASTER: Syed Huq (408) 525-3399, Fax: (408) 526-5504
            shuq@cisco.com
            Manager, Hardware Engineering, Cisco Systems
            170 West Tasman Drive
            San Jose, CA 95134-1706

POSTMASTER: John Angulo (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008
            jangulo@innoveda.com
            Development Engineer, Innoveda
            14715 N.E. 95th Street, Suite 200
            Redmond, WA 98052

This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA
Manual of Organization and Procedure.

The following e-mail addresses are used:

  majordomo@eda.org
      In the body, for the IBIS Open Forum Reflector:
      subscribe ibis <your e-mail address>

      In the body, for the IBIS Users' Group Reflector:
      subscribe ibis-users <your e-mail address>

      Help and other commands:
      help

  ibis-request@eda.org
      To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector
      (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org)
      or both. State your request.

  ibis-info@eda.org
      To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions
      for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS
      Open Forum as a full Member.

  ibis@eda.org
      To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This
      is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS
      technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted.

  ibis-users@eda.org
      To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is
      used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and
      general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted.

  ibischk-bug@eda.org
      To report ibischk2/3 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on
      eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported
      bugs.

      To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms
      which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt,
      /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, and
      /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively.

Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual
IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the
Electronic Information Group under:

  http://www.eigroup.org/ibis/ibis.htm

Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous
discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous.

============================================================================



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