================================================================================ IBIS INTERCONNECT TASK GROUP Mailing list: ibis-interconnect@freelists.org ================================================================================ Attendees from December 13, 2023 Meeting (* means attended at least using audio) ANSYS Curtis Clark Broadcom James Church Intel Corp. Michael Mirmak* Michael Brownell Keysight Technologies Ming Yan Marvell Steve Parker MathWorks Walter Katz Micron Technology Justin Butterfield Siemens EDA Weston Beal*, Arpad Muranyi*, Randy Wolff* ST Microelectronics Aurora Sanna Teraspeed Labs Bob Ross* University of Illinois Jose Schutt-Aine Zuken USA Lance Wang* Michael Mirmak convened the meeting and took minutes. No patents were declared. Michael noted that the minutes of the December 6 meeting were not yet available for review. During the AR review, Randy Wolff noted that his AR regarding a known issues document has been completed; he briefly outlined the document's contents. It contains an internal link which is not yet live. At present, it contains only two issues, as the others are covered in TSIRDs. The document will be posted when Touchstone 2.1 is approved. Michael noted that his AR regarding sending the updated PLS document to the reflector has been completed. Michael reviewed the Touchstone 2.1 draft 3 document, which was posted after an AR given during the November IBIS Open Forum meeting. This version reorders the appendices versus the references list, updates the Table of Contents, and corrects the formatting of the chapter headings. Arpad Muranyi asked whether the references should be at the very end of the document. Randy looked up the APA citation format; according to this, references should appear before appendices. The IEEE format is not clear. Michael noted that the IEEE Editorial Style Manual is available online: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ieee.org_content_dam_ieee-2Dorg_ieee_web_org_conferences_style-5Freferences-5Fmanual.pdf&d=DwIGaQ&c=nKjWec2b6R0mOyPaz7xtfQ&r=DcQR-qLpQg5lIreuM6-NYECRIAFXt268PRNS5WO043M&m=pXbSpbYGo1MYX_phY2-VWsg3I_jkgj-sfYnHyqzsD7wRnYgTom7TVifgzrlaEXkW&s=-d4anGuXHiDhIH3udRYXp6sGlyD3tKxslqEF8Js2VTM&e= Michael took the AR to talk to Lance about alerting people to draft 3 using the IBIS reflector. [AR] Arpad noted that the pole-residue document contains no changes since last week. He has received no feedback on the direction for adoption of the Foster format. Bob replied that the pole-residue format is likely superior to Foster, and good enough if conversion equations could be added to the document (and that IBIS-ISS supports it). Michael asked about IBIS-ISS and Touchstone 3.0 adoption. If IBIS-ISS adopts the S-element using Touchstone 3.0 data, then all formats are automatically supported. Bob replied that, unless HSPICE adopts it, it's a moot point. Arpad suggested that the document simply point to the format. Randy replied that Foster is just the format for the controlled sources; EDA vendors have to figure out how to use the data. Michael observed that cross-referencing specifications to other specifications without version information/restrictions being carried along could cause compatibility problems. IBIS-ISS has major issue (at least one) related to this; are we permitted to extend it beyond its HSPICE roots? Weston Beal asked, if we are locked to the Synopsys HSPICE passive interconnect format, can we just say we support HSPICE, with no specification details beyond this? Randy replied that this would just be a list of elements supported. Michael replied that the task of building support for Touchstone changes includes building support by EDA vendors; just issuing a specification update is not enough to secure adoption in the industry. Arpad showed the IBIS-ISS specification for Foster data and the S-element. The data is limited to two ports at present. Vladimir Dmitriev-Zdorov's conversion equations cover an arbitrary number of terminals/ports. Foster pole-residue details are covered in a transfer function also present in IBIS-ISS. Michael replied that nothing can be supported "free"; if we want to leverage an existing data format, including IBIS-ISS, the team would need to do the work to add multi-port support. Bob stated that we would need to break down the equation into the port-specific details. Randy replied that the team and specification do not need to prove conversion is possible. Bob responded that this is nonetheless desirable. Arpad asked why the team should reinvent the wheel, if we already have the specification. Foster only supports two ports at a time. Bob replied that the format can support n-port networks two ports at a time. Michael responded that the team needs a "lay-up" (easily-supported format), and that he is not seeing it here. Bob suggested reaching out to Ming Yan at Keysight and others to see what they have implemented. Arpad stated that Vladimir Dmitriev-Zdorov's presentation at the IBIS Summit noted that all EDA vendors convert to pole-residue "under the hood" when S-parameters are provided. The IBIS-ISS solution is not a multi-port solution. Bob asked whether a release from Siemens is needed to use the PLS (pole-residue) format. Arpad added that he was thinking of documenting the format in the TSIRD text. Bob added that it would be useful to have this in the document. The team agreed that PLS remains the direction for the document. The next meeting will review a draft update along with Bob's comments. Arpad moved to adjourn the meeting; Bob seconded. The meeting adjourned. The next meeting will take place on December 20, 2023. ================================================================================ Bin List: 1) [Complete draft Touchstone document separating version 1.0 and 2.0 into their own chapters] - REMOVED 2) Create structures to encapsulate Touchstone 1.0 data in Touchstone 2+ specifications - TABLED 3) Complete draft Touchstone 2.0 document containing TSIRD3 and TSIRD4 draft (Muranyi) – COMPLETED IN DRAFT 10 4) Complete pole-residue format BIRD draft (Muranyi) 5) Complete port naming proposal (Katz) 6) Create alternatives to the Touchstone 1.0 option line before the "R" character - TABLED 7) Complete ISS-IRD 1 Draft - Enable Cascading of S-parameters Through W-element (Mirmak) - TABLED 8) Complete/revise Touchstone 3.0 draft outline (Mirmak) – dependent on several items above Tabled ARs: - Arpad to give an example of the physical connectivity needed for EMD automation.