DATE: April 13, 1995 FROM: Will Hobbs (503) 264-4369, fax (503) 264-4210 Will_Hobbs@ccm.jf.intel.com Modeling Manager, Intel Corp., Chairperson, EIA IBIS Open Forum 5200 NE Elam Young Pkwy, Hillsboro, OR 97124 USA and Derrick Duehren (503) 264-4299, fax (503) 264-4904 Derrick_Duehren@ccm.jf.intel.com Intel Program Manager, IBIS Secretary SUBJECT: Minutes from EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting 4/7/95 PARTICIPANTS: ARPA Randy Harr AT&T Global Info Solutions Dave Moxley* Anacad Steffen Rochel Ansoft Henri Maramis Atmel Corporation Dan Terry Cadence Design Sandeep Khanna, C. Kumar* Cadlab Ralf Bruning Contec [M] Dileep Divekar* Digital Equipment Corp. Barry Katz EIA Patty Rusher High Design Technology Michael Smith, Dr. Ing. Cosso HP Palo Alto Tom Langdorf HP EESof Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu HyperLynx [M] Kellee Crisafulli* IBM Jay Diepenbrock, Joseph Flanigan IBM-Motorola alliance Lynn Warriner, John Burnett INCASES [M] Werner Rissiek, Olaf Rethmeier* Integrated Silicon Systems Eric Bracken Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Don Telian, Will Hobbs* Arpad Muranyi*, Derrick Duehren*, Tim Schreyer Interconnectix, Inc. [M] Bob Ross* Intergraph Ian Dodd, David Wiens, Walter Katz IntuSoft Charles Hymowitz Mentor Graphics Ravender Goyal, Greg Doyle Meta-Software Mei Wong, You-Pang Wei, John Sliney MicroSim Arthur Wong National Semiconductor [M] Syed Huq, Raj Raghuraum, Atul Agarwal NEC [M] Hiroshi Matsumoto North Carolina State U. Steve Lipa, Michael Steer OptEM Engineering, Inc. Benny Leveille, Ken Ehn Pacific Numerix Paul K. U. Wang Quad Design Jon Powell* Quantic Labs [M] Mike Ventham Symmetry Martin Walker Synopsys, Logic Modeling G. Bill Lattin Texas Instruments [M] Bob Ward Thomson-CSF/SCTF [M] Jean Lebrun UniCAD Canada Ltd. Stephen Lum Zuken-Redac [M] John Berrie Zeelan Technology George Opsahl, Hiro Moriyasu In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Voting members are indicated by [M]. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # 5/5/95 (916) 356-9999 461609 5/26/95 (916) 356-9999 485256 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 10:00 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each open forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- CHECK-IN, INTROS, ANNOUNCEMENTS There were no corrections made to last month's minutes. New participant: David Johnson (BrianJohnson@vax.micron.com), of Micron Technology, applications engineering. Micron Technology is supplying Spice models to customers and wants to send IBIS models instead for greater accuracy and so they don't have to worry about intellectual property issues. AR Derrick -- Publish an explanation of how to join the EIA IBIS group. [Done -- below] To become a voting member of the forum, send $500 annual dues to: EIA/Electronic Information Group c/o Patti Rusher 2500 Wilson Blvd. Arlington, VA 22201 (703) 907-7545 Fax: (703) 907-7501 Email: prusher@eia.org The source code to the Golden Parser is available for $500 (or $250 for voting members). Send requests for the parser to Patti Rusher. EIA IBIS MEMBERSHIP UPDATE: The following companies have become voting members of the EIA IBIS Open Forum. Contec Microelectronics $750.00 (licensed parser) HyperLynx $250.00 (licensed parser) INCASES Engineering GmbH $250.00 (licensed parser) Interconnectix $250.00 (licensed parser) National Semiconductor $250.00 (licensed parser) NEC Corporation $500.00 Quantic Labs $250.00 (licensed parser) Texas Instruments $500.00 Thomson-CSF $0 (DAD Member) Zuken-Redac $500.00 Intel appears to have lost its membership letter. Pattie is sending a replacement. FYI: The IBIS ANSI Project Number is 3527. That will also be its Standards Proposal number. NEW AGENDA ITEMS: None. PRESS UPDATES: The March 16 EDN Magazine has a feature article on IBIS by Derrick, Will, Arpad, and Robin Rosenbaum. NEW MODELS AVAILABLE: Arpad will be posting some models soon. Micron Technology has some preliminary IBIS models for 32-bit cache SRAMs for Pentium(R) processors that they are willing to post. David Johnson will work with Kellee and Bob Ross to get his files checked and posted to vhdl.org. PROGRESS TOWARD ENLISTING NEW IC VENDORS Will has been getting three times the requests on ibis-info since the EDN article came out. GOLDEN PARSER 2.1 PROGRESS AND RELEASE DATE Stephen reported a GP error with N/As in the typ. column. GP Release date: Will recommended that we release the GP `now' (with know bugs fixed), rather than continuing to do turns. Paul Munsey was not available to comment. AR Arpad -- Contact Paul, determine status of the release, and post it to the reflector. [Update: Paul and Ron want another beta with all previously paid-for fixes incorporated. After verification, they will add the subsequent changes, such as case and ^M.] EIA AFFILIATION STATUS Eight companies have joined the EIA IBIS subcommittee (10 as of 4/12/95). We decided to allow Design Automation Div. members to waive the $500 dues. They will get the same discount on purchasing the GP source code as other paid members. Derrick pointed out that the Design Automation Div., as our parent organization, insures our finances, so it's not such a bad deal. We need a Press Release announcing our EIA affiliation and Spec balloting. Derrick is putting the boilerplate fluff around the spec so it meets the EIA's voting standards, due 4/10 to Pattie Rusher [Done 4/13/95], with an expected quick turnaround for balloting. AR Derrick -- Talk to Pattie Rusher. [Done] o Clarify DAD parser licensing ($250), non-member GP licensing ($500), and the fee for DAD membership. [DAD membership is $1,000 - $15,000 depending on size of company.] o Clarify process/schedule for the vote on IBIS 2.1 Spec. [Spec will go out for ballot about 1 week after Pattie receives the "fluffed" spec from Derrick. We will need to decide how we will process responses/change requests. Do we need a subcommittee?] o Inform her of the need for a Press Release. [Pattie will do.]] o Does EIA have a WWW home page? We'd like to have one. [YES. Contact Cecilia Fleming (703) 907-7554, cfleming@eia.org.] o Best way to roll in our passed BIRDs into the election. Should we ballot on a Version 2.2? [Pattie recommends keeping it as 2.1 with erratta calling out the updates. Derrick will implement this in his "fluffed": spec.] PLANS FOR IBIS MEETING AT DAC (JUNE 2ND - 16TH) We will have a face-to-face meeting at DAC to elect officers and conduct other business Thurs. 6/15/95, 8:30 - 1:00. Jon has drafted an "IBIS Spoken Here" placard. He asked for feedback on how fancy they should be. Consensus was something in the $25 range (8.5" x 11" on foamboard backing). Each participant will pay for their own placard. Kellee wants to use the placard design at WinEDA. AR Jon -- Send placard file to Derrick for posting to vhdl.org. Birds of Feather. Jon Powell will put together a BOF poster following the same motif as the placards. He also volunteered to present some overview foils (30 min.) to get the BOF conversation going. AR Jon -- Sign us up for a BOF session and prepare the foils. REV 2.1 UPDATES o S2IBIS 2.1 No discussion. o Cookbook Kelley and Bob Ross have done very little, but expect to work on it in the coming weeks. o Overview No discussion. SGML/HTML SUPPORT? Syed was not present to comment, although we briefly discussed our desire to have a WWW home page. Derrick will follow up with Pattie Rusher. BIRD 26 - TAB CHARACTERS DISCOURAGED IN .IBS FILES Vote taken, BIRD 26 APPROVED UNANIMOUSLY. (Unofficially, since only 4 `official' membership companies were present -- we need 5. We will reconfirm at the next meeting when more companies have officially joined the EIA IBIS subcommittee.) BIRD 27 - NEW KEYWORD FOR DIFFERENTIAL I/O BIRD 27 adds a capability that is already there. It is a convenience only. The forum agrees that we should not add things just for convenience and recommends not approving BIRD 27 at this point. DIODE TRANSIT TIMES Tim Schreyer will attend the next meeting to discuss this topic. ENHANCEMENT TO THE TIMING SPEC Stephen lead a discussion on how to model packages with transmission line effects. Two ways proposed: Stephen suggested we use the existing matrix methodology with extensions, and Kellee suggested using a PCB type of description. Kellee suggested allowing bonding pad to board rlc and board to pin rlc for bonding wires and PCB description for the in-package board. Jon said that many off-shore ASIC vendors hand draw the circuit boards, so there is no path in those cases for getting this data. Jon does like the PCB description because it improves the ability to discern crosstalk between the traces and wires, etc. MCMs, SIMMs, complex packages, multi-cavity packages, hybrids, etc. can all be described with PCB approach. This may be revealing proprietary info, and eliminates level 1 modeling capability in those cases. Some had concerns that many semiconductor companies won't be willing to put this level of package details in the models. After a lengthy discussion, we acknowledged that the existing capabilities in the spec are better than nothing. Kellee wants to keep the number of new descriptions to a minimum, since we already have 3 descriptions. (single rlc, rlc per pin, rlgc). The question is, do we need 2 additional descriptions (1. transmission line segment description or coupled rlgc matrix 2. full PCB description.) or will one additional description suffice? Any vendor that would like to experiment with Intel's complex package models, send a request to speters@ichips.intel.com (Jon, Kellee, Bob R.). AR Derrick/Stephen: Send the complex package models to Jon, Kellee, Bob R. [Done] David J. informed us that a Jedec package measurement spec (JCB-95-10) is being voted on now that may give us some ideas. AR Stephen -- Evaluate the Jedec proposal. WRAP-UP, NEXT MEETING PLANS Our next meeting is a teleconference 5/5/95 (pushed out one week due to WinEDA and other events that week). ============================================================================== NOTES To become a voting member of the EIA IBIS Open Forum, send email to ibis-info@vhdl.org for instructions. If you want to join the e-mail reflector (ibis@vhdl.org), send e-mail to the IBIS secretary at ibis-request@vhdl.org. Check the pub/ibis directory on vhdl.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via ftp anonymous, "guest" login from telnet or dial-in (415-335-0110), or send an email request to the automatic archive server, archive@vhdl.org. ==============================================================================