DATE: February 21, 1996 SUBJECT: 2/16/96 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 1996 PARTICIPANTS LIST: Cadence Design C. Kumar* Contec CAE, Ltd. Dileep Divekar, Norio Matsui Hewlett Packard, EEsof Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli IBM (Jay Diepenbrock) INCASES Olaf Rethmeier* Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Will Hobbs*, Arpad Muranyi*, John Keifer, Aaron Tang, Duane Quiet*, Donald Telian, Jim Kruchowski Interconnectix, Inc. Bob Ross* Meta-Software (Les Spruiell) Mitsubushi Tam Cao Motorola (Ron Werner) National Semiconductor Syed Huq*, Donald Snyder, Chune-Sin Yeh NCR (formerly ATT-GIS) Dave Moxley*, Richard Mellitz NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto), Quad Design Jon Powell, Chris Rokusek* Quantic Labs (Mike Ventham) Tanner Research, Inc. (Scott Wedge) Texas Instruments Roger Cline, Ben Andresen, Sri Jandhyala, Tareq Shahwan, Dan Phipps Thomson-CSF/SCTF (Jean LeBrun) UniCAD Canada Ltd. Celso Faia VLSI Technology Dick Ulmer, Sung Oh*, Swami Gangadharan, Daniel Kim, Tom Dockery Zuken-Redac (John Berrie) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1996: Alcatel John Fitzpatrick* Altera Vadim von Brzeski AMP Hank Herrmann* Apteq Design System Dan FitzPatrick Compaq Mark Leonard Cypress Bruce Wenniger Digital Equipment Corp. Jeff Chu* EIA Patti Rusher IC Works Eric Chen Intergraph/Veribest Ian Dodd Micron Technology Brian Johnson MicroSim Ralph Perez North Carolina State U. (Michael Steer) S3, Inc. Sarathy Sribhashyam, Phap Duong Seimans Nixdorf Arnaud Lacariere Tektronix, Inc. Brock Hannibal TRW & Free Model Foundation Robert Harrison Zeelan Technology George Opsahl* In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principle members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode 3/8/96 (916) 356-9200 1-55736 5232597 3/29/96 (916) 356-9200 1-55737 1119667 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each open forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS Jeff Chu of Digital Equipment Corporation indicated that Digital has an interest in making including those for the Alpha Chip and using IBIS models. John Fitzpatrick of Alcatel called from France and gave a description of his role in the general technology lab of a hardware design group. Alcatel uses IBIS models for general rule checking and also for some analog analysis. EIA MEMBERSHIP AND TREASURER'S REPORT Patti Rusher reports that Mitusbishi Electric in Durham, North Carolina has become a full member the EIA IBIS Committee. MINUTES REPORT, MISC. No corrections. Will Hobbs will give Bob Ross some minor text corrections. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS Bob Ross would like electronic copies of the Face to Face meeting slides sent to him for putting on vhdl.org. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Richard Goering column "EDA caught in Web" in Electronic Engineering Times, February 12, 1996, pg. 76 mentions winibis and HyperLynx home page and IBIS. Zen Mu and Paul Wang wrote "Developing Simulation Models for High-Speed Applications" in Printed Circuit Design, February, 1996, pp. 30-34 mentions IBIS. A Netscape search using [IBIS Models] yields several sites including the Motorola Power PC IBIS models and a downloadable application note on IBIS models from Micron Technology. NEW MODELS Syed Huq reported National Semiconductor has released three new models. Arpad Muranyi reported that Intel will post one new model. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES vhdl.org update Roster update EIA/IBIS 1996 MEMBERSHIP NCR, Intel, and Interconnectix reported that revised invoices have not been received. AR - Bob Ross call EIA and find out what has happened [Done - Copies of the latest invoice will be FAXed to companies since reissuing invoices causes accounting problems.] DAC STANDARDS BOOTH The Design Automation Conference (DAC) in June, 1996 will have a Standards booth. We will have literature, and the booth will serve as a place where IBIS people can meet and convey IBIS information. ANSI/EIA-656 INTERNATIONAL RATIFICATION Patti Rusher has reported that the US TAG (Technical Advisory Group) has approved a New Work Item Proposal for IBIS to go to IEC TC93. ANSI/EIA-656 PUBLICATION The document is currently in the EIA publications department being prepared to be forwarded to Global Engineering Documents for distribution. EIA WEB UPDATE Syed Huq reported that EIA has added a direct link to the IBIS Web page under the Design Automation Division subgroup by accessing http://www.eia.org Syed is investigating Web counting programs with Steve Malone of EIA that work with a PC server. While we are an organization, we still may decide to pay for usage of a shareware program. Syed's plan is to publicize the Web site once the counter is installed. Olaf Rethmeier indicated INCASES may want to supply an updated logo. He should send it directly to Jon Powell since the permission letter is already on file. VHDL.ORG The reflector has been fixed by Randy Harr and is working. So individuals reported that messages come from "owner-ibis". Bob Ross will investigate. ROSTER UPDATE Bob Ross has received responses for Roster update information from about half of the people. Bob will seek responses and post the new roster soon. Non-member companies who do not respond will be dropped. GOLDEN PARSER UPDATE Bob Ross will formally issue the three bugs through the newly established parser reporting system before we issue a parser correction. A bug directory exists, and a BUG form will be available there. SPICE TO IBIS VERSION 2.1 Bob Ross reported no further information, but will ask Michael Steer for a report on its status regarding reported problems. SPICE TO IBIS PLOT VERSION 1.2 A corrected version has been put on vhdl.org. It requires perl and gnuplot, but works very nicely to display the IBIS V/I and V/T tables. PRIORITIES FOR 1996 Will Hobbs discussed priorities for 1996. He suggested validation, extended package models, diode transit time, and connectors. Hank Herrmann pointed out that connectors are different than extended package models. Bob Ross added staggered turn-on time buffers. Will added feedback. Arpad Muranyi asked if scaling was also an important item. Stephen Peters mention SSO. Chris Rokusek wants clarification on worse case and best case parameters in IBIS. Other specification additions for hysteresis, undershoot, overshoot, were suggested by Bob. The tabulated list is shown: validation (post 4 or 5 reality checks and add to parser) extended package models (electrical and physical) diodes connectors staggered turn-on buffers feedback scaling better handling of SSO clarification of worst case and best case corners specification parameters (hysteresis, overshoot, etc.) cookbook (may contain validation and corners) new overview more models ... Will proposed we have IBIS Version 3.0 by the end of the year. Bob would like to see a good start by DAC, but would be comfortable with late summer. It was suggested that priority voting be done on the reflector. BIRD33 (EGG8) - PHYSICAL PACKAGE DISCUSSION Olaf Rethmeier referred to the physical description that Kellee Crisafulli had offered. He said that a European group (JESSI) has defined a physical multiboard PCB description sponsored by EC. He is waiting to make an appropriate overview available. Olaf says it is similar to what Kellee has proposed. It describes a neutral format, is a context free grammar, is simple to parse and is human-readable. It has been under development for two years. It is not yet a standard. Olaf will post SULTAN (Standard Universal Layout Information Transport Language) information the reflector. BIRD31 - CONNECTOR MODELS Bob Ross still plans to issue a revised BIRD31.1 within a few weeks to reflect the changes that were discussed at previous meetings and from older comments. BIRD32 PACKAGE MODEL ENHANCEMENT C. Kumar is still interested in a more general electrical description including some Spice-like capability. Stephen Peters is concerned about the Ball Grid Array model which includes and extra stub. EGG9 - HANDLING STORED CHARGE Bob Ross has sent code to Jon Powell for further investigation and plans to issue a BIRD. BIRD34 was assigned by Will Hobbs. VALIDATION In the remaining time, Will Hobbs opened a discussion on validation, one of the items on the priority list. He noted that some vendors are reluctant to release IBIS models because they are not sure how they should be checked. Regarding the disclaimer, Stephen Peters indicates that the typical disclaimer is that the model is used for ".. modeling purposes only, and the results are not guaranteed." This is a fairly typical legal statement. He feels that the model provider can only guarantee that the model data is correct. How well it performs in simulation depends on the simulator. Duane Quite wants more information on equipment and techniques used to develop models such as the test fixtures and process. Arpad Muranyi indicates he has a specification on his tool which gives data derivation methodologies. Duane feels that the level of communication between the model creator and the consumer needs to be increased. Syed Huq suggests a contact name. Hank Herrmann would like some procedure to indicate that the model is validated and perhaps how. The intent is to define the range over which the model can be trusted and to increase the comfort level of the customers. The [File Rev] in the IBIS specification is not mandatory, but can be used to state the level of validation. Dave Moxley described the NCR test board validation process where simulations with Spice and IBIS are correlated. Will mentioned the IBIS model can contain a "golden waveform" within it for reference. Syed Huq described the National process where models are extracted from bench measurements and validated using a tool. A test circuit is simulated, and the results are correlated with measurements. Bob Ross questioned the verification of some Spice models and wondered what process is used to validate them. Arpad described further his work which develops Version 2.1 models for CMOS. He started his work prior to the North Carolina State University work, and therefore it is not based on the s2ibis2 utility. He cannot share the tool itself due to a licensing restriction. In closing, Will would like the IBIS forum to develop an application note on validation. Perhaps a technical writer could be hired. NEXT MEETING: The next telephone meeting is set for Friday, March 8, 1996. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Will Hobbs (503) 264-4369, Fax (503) 264-4210 will_hobbs@ccm.jf.intel.com Server Chipset System Validation Manager, Intel Corp. 2111 NE 28th M/S JF1-57, Hillsboro, OR 97124 USA VICE CHAIR: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jonp@qdt.com Transmission-Line Products Manager, Quad Design 1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010 SECRETARY: Bob Ross (503) 603-2523, fax (503) 639-3469 bob@icx.com Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix, Inc. 10220 SW Nimbus Ave, K4, Portland, OR 97223 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@vhdl.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@vhdl.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@vhdl.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@vhdl.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@vhdl.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. ibis-users@vhdl.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. ibischk-bug@vhdl.org To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on vhdl.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page: http://www.eia.org/eig/ibis/ibis.htm Check the pub/ibis directory on vhdl.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via ftp anonymous, "guest" login from telnet or dial-in (415-335-0110), or send an e-mail request to the automatic archive server, archive@vhdl.org. "IBIS Spoken Here" placards are available from Jon Powell (jonp@qdt.com) for use at trade shows. ==============================================================================