DATE: July 2, 1996 SUBJECT: 6/28/96 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 1996 PARTICIPANTS LIST: AMP Hank Herrmann*, Tim Minnick, Russ Moser Cadence Design C. Kumar Contec CAE, Ltd. Dileep Divekar*, Norio Matsui, Antonis Orphanou Cypress Bruce Wenniger Hewlett Packard, EEsof Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli* INCASES Olaf Rethmeier*, Ralf Bruening Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Will Hobbs*, Arpad Muranyi*, John Keifer, Aaron Tang, Duane Quiet, [Donald Telian], Jim Kruchowski Interconnectix, Inc. Bob Ross, Chris Reid* Meta-Software (Sanjay Gangal) Mitsubushi Tam Cao, Hoang Nguyen Motorola Ahmed Omer National Semiconductor Syed Huq*, Donald Snyder, Chune-Sin Yeh, Bill Aronson NCR (formerly ATT-GIS) Dave Moxley*, Richard Mellitz NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto), Quad Design Jon Powell*, Chris Rokusek* Texas Instruments Roger Cline, Ben Andresen, Sri Jandhyala, Tareq Shahwan, Dan Phipps Thomson-CSF/SCTF (Jean LeBrun) UniCAD Canada Ltd. Celso Faia* VLSI Technology Dick Ulmer, Sung Oh, Swami Gangadharan, Daniel Kim, Tom Dockery, D.C. Sessions Zuken-Redac (John Berrie) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1996: Alcatel John Fitzpatrick* Altera Vadim von Brzeski Apteq Design System Dan FitzPatrick Compaq Mark Leonard Digital Equipment Corp. Jeff Chu* EIA Patti Rusher* IC Works Eric Chen Micron Technology Brian Johnson MicroSim Ralph Perez Molex Gus Panella North Carolina State U. (Michael Steer) Oki Semiconductor Tom Chao Philips Semiconductor Mike Magdaluyo Rockwell Collins Thomas Thurman S3, Inc. Sarathy Sribhashyam, Phap Duong Seimans Nixdorf Arnaud Lacariere Symmetry Andy Hughes Tektronix, Inc. Brock Hannibal TRW & Free Model Foundation Robert Harrison Veribest Ian Dodd, David Wiens VTC, Inc. Bob Ward Zeelan Technology George Opsahl In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principle members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who have joined another organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode 7/19/96 (916) 356-9200 2-78903 6186335 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each open forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS Syed Huq chaired the meeting, and Jon Powell served as secretary. (These minutes are based on Jon's and Will Hobb's notes and other inputs.) EIA MEMBERSHIP AND TREASURER'S REPORT Patti Rusher did not have updated figures, but estimates the treasury at about $6000 to $8000. The treasurer's report was garbled due to a bug in Patti's program. EIA will issue a new report soon. AMP's invoice situation has been taken care of for now. MINUTES REPORT, MISC. The spelling Peivand Tehrani's last name has been corrected, and the paper is on page 1009 of the conference proceedings. The last meetings 9 AM to 1 PM times and Las Vegas, Nevada location have been added to the minutes. All previous AR's were handled including issuing BIRD36 and BIRD37 and data related to multi-staged driver models. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Electronic Design, June 10, 1996, page 64, a HyperLynx introduction references IBIS. Electrical Engineering Times, June 17, 1996, pg. 86, a Veribest introduction references IBIS. Electronic News, June 17, 1996, pg. 46, Symmetry Design Systems announces IBIS modeling service and future models. The 1996 National Interface Databook, Chapter 13 on Modeling Support is devoted entirely to IBIS models and provides "An Introduction to IBIS Modeling Section" by Syed Huq, and also references many of the participating IBIS Committee CAE vendors and their tools. VLSI IBIS models are now available on the Web: http://www.vlsi.com/vlsi/products/ibis/ibis.html The EIA/IBIS web page has been enhanced to add tools selection. Quad Design is adding a page with hot links to all free IBIS models available throughout industry. Patti Rusher reports that the IBIS page is the second most popular EIA page. NEW MODELS None reported. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES Secretary Position Series Resistor INTERNATIONAL STANDARDIZATION Patti Rusher Indicated that there is a project underway to gain money from DARPA for modeling programs. The intention is to use the money to fill holes in the standards efforts, such as funding the Express Model. This is problematic since the University of Manchester can not receive US grant money directly. They would have to be sub-contracted through a US company or university. Some funding options exist and there may be some news in several weeks. Will Hobbs and Stephen Peters will give a presentation on modeling standards at an international conference in Prague in July, 1996. AR - Stephen Peters and Will Hobbs will discuss the money and time for Express Representation with Hilary Kahn in Prague at an international standards conference. Ron Waxman has introduced IBIS as a work item into the IEC process. So even without Express, the international standardization process is underway. SECRETARY Will Hobbs feels that the lack of a secretary needs resolution. For now we are sharing the duty from meeting to meeting. No one at the meeting indicated an interest in taking the post. This must be a person from a member company since it is an official EIA committee position. AR - Syed Huq post a request to ibis@vhdl.org requesting volunteers. EGG11 - ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM VOLTAGE John Fitzpatrick of Alcatel requested a field be added to the model to specify the maximum voltage that can be sustained without damage. Semiconductor suppliers do not generally want to give out this information. The issue is important for PCI interface components and components with split supplies. One use for this information would be to have the simulator pop out a warning if the maximum voltage limits (voltage versus time) is exceeded. This could be handled on a per-model basis, as an optional parameter or parameters. It might need to be a table. Jon Powell asked if it was a non-linear table. John indicated that it could be highly non-linear. This information could be tabulated like the other IBIS tables. It could also be a single value. Both positive and negative voltages would be tabulated. Kellee Chrisafulli pointed out that it may have to be power supply relative, such as one diode over Vcc. John plans to accept the comments and convert this into a BIRD. Several EDA vendors indicated that they would support issuing a message that indicates that the maximum safe levels have been exceeded. BIRD36 - ELECTRICAL BOARD DESCRIPTION Stephen Peters issued BIRD36 for an electrical board description. Hank Herrmann provided several comments: (1) Add a NC (No Connect) in the pin list for open sided connectors (2) Strike the word "mated" (for unmated models) (3) Change minimum "rise" time to minimum "edge" time. (4) Set a limit on the total number of externally accessible pins. (5) Set a 5 character limit for the total number of pins. (6) Change the maximum number of characters from 5 to 8 under [Pin List] (7) Under [Path Description] the for node, the subparameter could be a .ibs model. The discussion involved whether IBIS would allow an .ebd file to describe a populated SIMM, for example. There was a long discussion on whether this should be allowed to be embedded within a .ibs file, or visa-versa (making the IBIS Specification very complex), or to keep it as a separate file. The consensus was to keep it separate. The golden parser will still have to check .ebd files. It would be desirable to allow a .ebd file to contain a reference to another .ebd file, to support situations such as SIMMs that plug into SIMMs. Kellee Chrisafulli suggests we roll the BIRD such that the component can be either a .ibs or a .ebd file, and solicit further comments. Kellee was also concerned about the ambiguity of unit length. He feels it should be explicitly specified to be treated as distributed LRC elements in the section where the length is specified. Stephen will make this change. Chris Reid of Interconnectix noted that the pin number section has a potential problem with matrix creation when there is a mismatch between pin count and path count. If a 16 pin connector has 32 pins, how do you define the matrix? You would want a 16 X 16 matrix, not a 32 X 32 matrix. A few more examples would help. The specific changes were: (1) Add a keyword for reference designator mapping (ibs/ebd file and component). (2) Highlight that RLC are distributed. (3) Consider Hank's email comments. (4) Specify which pins are used in the matrix (or drop the matrix). The matrix issue needs to be reviewed. (5) What are the boundaries of the model. Where does one model end and another begin. It was suggested that Stephen roll in the suggested changes and issue BIRD36.1 for a possible vote next meeting. BIRD35.1 - MULTI-STAGED OUTPUTS Jon Powell described BIRD35.1 as a method for scheduling sequences of output buffer characteristics. The technical discussion was deferred until Bob Ross, author of BIRD35.1 can participate at the next meeting. Jon noted the primary problem with this type of output is that there is no way to create a model via measurement. Such buffers are usually implemented with internal delay lines to which measurements have no access. Only the chip manufacturer would have access to this information. However, the conclusion was that BIRD35.1 is ready for a vote. EGG10 - PARSER ADDITIONS FOR NUMERICAL CHECKING Chris Rokusek stated that EGG10 checks for reasonable values in IBIS files. Chris has extracted all of the parameters out of an IBIS file and found some out of range values. The raw data can be analyzed and discussed at the next meeting. Arpad Muranyi noted that the data format of the files that were sent out were inaccessible to him. (The data was retransmitted in ASCII form.) SERIES RESISTOR Arpad Muranyi suggested that we add support for series devices such as diodes and resistors to IBIS 3.0. Jon Powell felt this was OK as long as the component could be specified as a V/I curve. NEXT MEETING: The next meeting is on Friday, July 19, 1996, 8:00 A.M. to 10:00 A.M. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 603-2523, Fax (503) 639-3469 bob@icx.com Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix, Inc. 10220 SW Nimbus Ave, K4, Portland, OR 97223 VICE CHAIR: Syed Huq (408) 721-4874, Fax: (408) 721-4785 huq@rockie.nsc.com Staff Applications Engineer, National Semiconductor, M/S A-2595 2900 Semiconductor Drive, Santa Clara, CA 95052 LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jonp@qdt.com Transmission-Line Products Manager, Quad Design 1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010 SECRETARY: Vacant This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@vhdl.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@vhdl.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@vhdl.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@vhdl.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@vhdl.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. ibis-users@vhdl.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. ibischk-bug@vhdl.org To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on vhdl.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eia.org Check the pub/ibis directory on vhdl.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via ftp anonymous, "guest" login from telnet or dial-in (415-335-0110), or send an e-mail request to the automatic archive server, archive@vhdl.org. "IBIS Spoken Here" placards are available from Jon Powell (jonp@qdt.com) for use at trade shows. ==============================================================================