DATE: September 30, 1996 SUBJECT: 9/27/96 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 1996 PARTICIPANTS LIST: AMP Hank Herrmann*, Tim Minnick, Russ Moser, Ray Ziesse* Applied Simulation Technology Dileep Divekar*, Norio Matsui, Antonis Orphanou (formerly Contec) Cadence Design C. Kumar Cypress Bruce Wenniger Hewlett Packard, EEsof Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli INCASES Olaf Rethmeier, Ralf Bruening Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Will Hobbs*, Arpad Muranyi*, John Keifer, Aaron Tang, Duane Quiet, [Donald Telian], Jim Kruchowski Interconnectix, Inc. Bob Ross*, Chris Reid Meta-Software (Sanjay Gangal) Mitsubushi Tam Cao, Hoang Nguyen Motorola Ahmed Omer* National Semiconductor Syed Huq*, [Donald Snyder], Chune-Sin Yeh, [Bill Aronson] NCR (formerly ATT-GIS) Dave Moxley*, Richard Mellitz NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto), Quad Design Jon Powell*, Chris Rokusek* Quantic Laboratories (Mike Ventham) Texas Instruments Roger Cline, Ben Andresen, Sri Jandhyala, Tareq Shahwan, Dan Phipps Thomson-CSF/SCTF (Jean LeBrun) UniCAD Canada Ltd. Celso Faia* Veribest Ian Dodd, David Wiens VLSI Technology Dick Ulmer, Sung Oh, Swami Gangadharan, Daniel Kim, Tom Dockery, D.C. Sessions, Hrish Patel Zuken-Redac (John Berrie) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1996: 3M Fran Hart* Alcatel John Fitzpatrick Altera Vadim von Brzeski Apteq Design System Dan FitzPatrick Compaq Mark Leonard Digital Equipment Corp. Jeff Chu* EIA Patti Rusher* IC Works Eric Chen Mentor Graphics Kim Owen Micron Technology Brian Johnson MicroSim Ralph Perez Molex Gus Panella North Carolina State U. (Michael Steer) Oki Semiconductor Tom Chao Philips Semiconductor Mike Magdaluyo Rockwell Collins Thomas Thurman S3, Inc. Sarathy Sribhashyam, Phap Duong Seimans Nixdorf Arnaud Lacariere Symmetry Andy Hughes Tektronix, Inc. Brock Hannibal TRW & Free Model Foundation Robert Harrison VTC, Inc. Bob Ward Zeelan Technology George Opsahl In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principle members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who have joined another organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode 10/18/96 (916) 356-9200 3-54605 8249548 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each open forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS Fran Hart from 3M joined. She is in the Electrical Products Group in Texas working with connectors, cables, and flex circuits. She provides the Spice models of connectors and cables, chip carriers and interconnects. Her current interest is in ground plane analysis. She is investigating IBIS is concerned about too much variation between the Spices. Dileep Divekar announced that Contec now has become Applied Simulation Technology, but remains the same. The roster and attendees list has been updated. EIA MEMBERSHIP AND TREASURER'S REPORT Jeff Chu reported that the DEC membership payment is progressing internally. Bob Ross reported receiving Patti Rusher's August 1996 IBIS ledger report. It shows $9,285, not change from last month. Patti indicated that some shared EIA expenses will be deducted before the end of the year. MINUTES REPORT, MISC. No corrections. All AR's were completed. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None. PRESS and WEB PAGE UPDATES Jon Powell reported the EDN, September 26, 1996, pp. 97-104, has and article "Solving signal-integrity problems in high-speed digital systems" which gives several references to IBIS. This article (minus a few paragraphs) was taken from Jon's presentation at Design SuperCon96 (co-sponsored by EDN). (Also, Greg Edlund wrote in EDN, July 18, 1996, pp. 111-124, " Noise budgets help maintain signal integrity in low-voltage systems" and advocated IBIS and Spice models. This article was also adapted from Greg's presentation at Design SuperCon96.) Bob Ross has put a Word Version of the final draft (before editorial revision) of the EE Times article (September 2, 1996) "IBIS standards provides I/O buffer models" on vhdl.org as /pub/ibis/documents/eet96.doc for downloading. Permission has been granted to do this. Syed Huq plans to convert the EE Times article into HTML and provide access through the EIA/IBIS home page. Fran Hart wanted access to the BIRD documents. Syed Huq plans to provide a link to the bird directory from the EIA/IBIS home page. There already is access directly from the http://vhdl.org/pub/ibis/birds. Arpad Muranyi and Bob worked on downloading some older document files (overview.*) and found some of them corrupted with ^M data. This included the *.ps, *.rtf and .wfw files. John Powell indicated that file uploading is very dependent on what OS was being used. He will investigate the document files and work with Bob if any change is needed (revise or remove). Bob also reports that the contacts.txt document is updated whenever new information or changes are received. Similarly the roster.txt is updated immediately. Now is a good time to review your entry and submit updates (or new roster information) to Bob. The address is at the top of the roster. NEW MODELS Arpad Muranyi will work with Jon Powell concerning an Intel update on the readme file for three new models under NDA. Stephen Peters also submits Intel readme information, but only for his area (PentiumPro, etc.). OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES Patti Rusher regarding DAC97 planning. DAC97 PLANNING (AND OTHER MEETINGS) Patti Rusher will be sending out letters to the heads of the various groups within EIA regarding participation plans for the Design Automation conference in June, 1997 in Anaheim, California. This discussion will be put of the agenda for the next meeting. National has offered to host the Design SuperCon97 IBIS meeting in Santa Clara California in late January 1997 on the Monday prior the conference. Other companies are welcome to offer hosting (or co-hosting) the event. It was very successful with about 45 very top-level participants. Will Hobbs indicated that it would be fair to hold some East Coast meetings since nearly all of the IBIS meetings have been on the West Coast. Fran Hart from Austin Texas thought that central USA might be a nice compromise! EIA/JAPAN - IBIS WORKING GROUP Bob Ross reported making contact with Hideki Fukuda of Hitachi who is in the Semiconductor Standardization Committee in EIAJ. The task group is surveying I/O interface models from the IC supplier's point of view. Bob has provided IBIS information, Hideki plans to keep Bob informed of the activities. Jon Powell and Arpad Muranyi reported other possible individuals. Patti Rusher works with higher level EIAJ individuals who would be aware of any serious new I/O buffer standardization efforts. EIAJ works with EIA, and EIA has international membership. IBIS is proceeding in the International arena, and Patti sees no serious parallel effort. IEC EXPRESS FUNDING PROGRESS Patti Rusher reports that IBIS has been submitted as a work item in IEC (International Electrotechnical Commission) in TC-93. She will receive confirmation that it has been accepted next week. The next step is for ANSI/EIA-656 (IBIS Version 2.1) to be forwarded to the standards bodies in of each member nation for formal voting. So funding for an Express format of IBIS is not needed at this time. Patti is working on a larger proposal to submit to DARPA related to a component information management system where users can select information from a component database. Standardized models could be part of the database. So any future funding proposals may reside within this larger proposal. Consequently, she is not pursuing the smaller standards cleanup proposal. BIRD34.1 - STORED CHARGE EFFECT (Vote) Bob Ross summarized that BIRD34.1 introduces two new optional keywords [TTgnd] and [TTpower] under [Model]. These allow a first order approximation of the stored charge glitch seen in practice. It is also seen in Spice simulations of unterminated, clamped transmission lines when the optional TT parameter is in in the Spice clamping diode modle. The new keywords are associated with [Gnd Clamp] and [Power Clamp] tables, respectively. Stephen Peters provided a minor editorial change. Bob received a correction regarding Zo and TD values. Arpad Muranyi wanted "nS" changed to "ns" to be consistent with the rest of IBIS. Arpad also reported that some of the "txt" figures were misaligned. Dileep Divekar questioned whether the test circuit in BIRD34.1 actually forward biased the diode to produce the effect. Bob confirmed that it did based on the impedance mismatches and corresponding reflections, and also based on actual Spice simulation. BIRD34.1 was approved by unanimous vote with the above changes. AR - Bob Ross issue approved BIRD34.2 containing the above corrections and upgrade the "work in progress" version of IBIS in the /pub/ibis/wip directory to include BIRD34.2. SPECIFICATION COMMITTEE REPORT Jon Powell reported on the first meeting. The mission is to deal with any parameter that does not effect actual performance of signal integrity or timing simulations. Thus the thresholds Vinh, Vinl and the timing references fall within the Specification domain. This group is discussing pulse width noise immunity, input threshold extensions including hysteresis, overshoot extensions including research on overshoot vs. time specification and other areas. This group consisting of Jon Powell, Jon Fitzpatrick, Ahmed Omer, and Bob Ross already has BIRD38 and other proposals. It expects to come to agreement and issue one or more specification BIRDs for IBIS Committee consideration. Arpad Muranyi and Jon raised the question regarding how IBIS pending specifications on overshoot relate to those in RAIL. Ahmed Omer and felt that RAIL related to the net specification, whereas IBIS is related to the part itself. Bob felt that the RAIL specification might override and IBIS specification in processing, but the actual handling would be simulator dependent - e.g., report an error or have one override the other. However, the designer might purposely specify tighter rules in RAIL corresponding to the weakest device rather than rely on device limits in IBIS. Thus the consensus was that there is no conflict. IBIS should proceed to consider including all relevant device related specification parameters. EGG10 - PARSER ADDITIONS FOR NUMERICAL CHECKING Bob Ross started the discussion by going over Chris Rukusek's suggestions that he mailed. Suggestion 5 related to setting Ramp, package, and C_comp value limits which would trigger flags. Arpad Muranyi and others felt that some of the limits were too tight based on some non-typical, but practical applications of IBIS. One suggestion is to increase the trigger values by three or six orders of magnitudes related to someone forgetting to put in units or for putting in extreme values. Will Hobbs and others suggested considering a configuration table or some other method so that the user could adjust the limits depending on the application. Bob stated that the proposal could be for ibis_chk (Version 1.1), ibischk2 (Version 2.1 which also includes the complete copy of ibis_chk for Version 1.1 checking). or a future ibischk3.x for future IBIS. One could also consider a separate utility for reality checking rather than work the logistics of retrofitting these older versions. The revised values for approximately three orders of magnitude are: C_comp 1 nF Pin C 1 nF Pin L 1 uH Pin R 1 k Ramp Times 1 ms Suggestion 3 related to defining when a diode has suspiciously large to warrant a warning message. The 10A, 1.5V limit seemed reasonable. Chis reported that he had seen this limit exceeded in only several IBIS files on vhdl.org, and these curves were suspicious. This setting would also fall within the configuration discussion. Suggestion 2 related to testing the waveform data endpoints with the I/V table data to assure consistency. There was general agreement to do this. Suggestion 1 related to a robust testing of I/V table polarities. Chris felt that the intent of the test was already being handled sufficiently by ibischk2 since it will issue a report based on endpoint polarity difference errors. Suggestion 4 related to some number of points and curvature detection test so that unstable numerical artifacts are flagged. There was much resistance to this because of the trickiness to determine the proper values. Plus, different simulators using different algorithms may have their unique sensitivities. So this suggestion is dropped. Bob and others thru discussion indicated that the next step is for Chris to work through the PARSER BUG REPORT process to take the results of this discussion and put forth a proposal for changing the parser. The BIRD process is used for actual specification changes. The items in EGG10 relate to ibischk parser enhancements and relate to issuing warning messages. AR - Chris Rokusek submit a proposal capturing the above directions in one or more IBIS GOLDEN PARSER BUG REPORT FORMs - as enhancement requests. For now, it should relate only to the golden parser. In the proposal, it is Chris' option whether to consider configuration tables or some other universal method, or just propose hard coded values since the Forum did not indicate any preference during the discussion. BIRD37.2 - ENHANCEMENT OT THE PACKAGE MODEL SPECIFICATION Stephen Peters recently issued BIRD37.2. It basically changes the approved BIRD28.3 by adding Fork and End Fork statements. It also removes the controversial Matrix extensions - thereby amending and superseding BIRD28.3. This is based on last meetings guidance that a controversial extension was worse than no extension. This does not prohibit considering cascaded sections in the future based on further understanding and agreement. Bob Ross had some minor editorial changes that do not effect the content of BIRD37.2. A vote on BIRD37.2 is planned at the next meeting. BIRD36 - ELECTRICAL BOARD DESCRIPTION Steve Peters felt that BIRD36 is stalled for a number of reasons. It also contains the cascaded Matrix extensions that were dropped in BIRD37.2. Plus there may be discomfort with the extensive syntax. Stephen proposed reconvening the Package Committee task group to reconsider BIRD36. The same members are expected to join. Also Fran Hart and Ahmed Omer indicated interest in joining. Everyone is welcome to join. AR - Stephen Peters get the telephone bridge numbers and send out a message on vhdl.org announcing the details of the Package Committee meetings. BIRD35.1 - MULTI-STAGED OUTPUTS Bob Ross still plans to produce BIRD35.2 taking into account Jon Powell's sample syntax and IBIS syntax. AR - Bob Ross produce BIRD35.2 before next meeting. NEXT MEETING: The next meeting is on Friday, October 18, 1996, 8:00 A.M. to 9:55 A.M. BIRD37.2 is scheduled for vote. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 603-2523, Fax (503) 639-3469 bob@icx.com Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix, Inc. 10220 SW Nimbus Ave, K4, Portland, OR 97223 VICE CHAIR: Syed Huq (408) 721-4874, Fax: (408) 721-4785 huq@rockie.nsc.com Staff Applications Engineer, National Semiconductor, M/S A-2595 2900 Semiconductor Drive, Santa Clara, CA 95052 LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jonp@qdt.com Transmission-Line Products Manager, Quad Design 1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010 SECRETARY: Vacant This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@vhdl.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@vhdl.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@vhdl.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@vhdl.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@vhdl.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. ibis-users@vhdl.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. ibischk-bug@vhdl.org To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on vhdl.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eia.org Check the pub/ibis directory on vhdl.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via ftp anonymous, "guest" login from telnet or dial-in (415-335-0110), or send an e-mail request to the automatic archive server, archive@vhdl.org. "IBIS Spoken Here" placards are available from Jon Powell (jonp@qdt.com) for use at trade shows. ==============================================================================