DATE: August 13, 1997 SUBJECT: 8/8/97 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 1997 PARTICIPANTS LIST: AMP Jeff Walden Applied Simulation Technology [Dileep Divekar], Norio Matsui, Raj Raghuram, Fred Balistreri* Cadence Design & UniCAD C. Kumar, Don Telian, Cameron Seitz Cypress Bruce Wenniger Digital Equipment Corp. Jeff Chu* High Design Technology (Razvan Ene) HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli, Steve Kaufer, Matthew Flora* INCASES Olaf Rethmeier*, Werner Rissiek Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Arpad Muranyi*, Henry Maramis, Will Hobbs, Frank Kern* Interconnectix Bob Ross* Mitsubushi Tam Cao, Hoang Nguyen Motorola [Ahmed Omer], Michael Desiderio, Paul Bolden, Tom Myers, Rob Wenzel* National Semiconductor Syed Huq*, Cheng-Yang Kao, Mike Bristol, Peter Laflamme, Kevin Smith NCR Dave Moxley, Richard Mellitz NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto) Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Texas Instruments Thomas Fisher Thomson-CSF/SCTF (Jean LeBrun) Viewlogic Jon Powell, Chris Rokusek*, Peivand Tehrani VeriBest Ian Dodd, William Bell VLSI Technology Harish Patel, D.C. Sessions OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1997: 3M [Fran Hart] Actel Scott Schlachter Acuson & Free Model Foundation Richard Munden Alcatel John Fitzpatrick Ansoft Eric Bogatin Apteq Design Systems Dan FitzPatrick Compaq Weston Beal, Mark Leonard Dell Computer Dave Baranauskas*, Doug Wallace* EIA Patti Rusher* EMC Fabrizio Zanella Hewlett Packard, EEsof Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu Hewlett Packard, France Jean-Christophe Pautrat Hitachi Saburo Hojo, Yasushi Ogawa IBM Brad Herrman Interface Technology Dan Waterloo Micron Technology Brian Johnson Molex Gus Panella North Carolina State U. (Michael Steer) S3, Inc. Porsh Shih, Sarathy Sribhashyam Symmetry Andy Hughes TRW Ray Steele Ultratest International Charles Im Zeelan Technology George Opsahl In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode September 5, 1997 (916) 356-9200 2-177650 2591118 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM The following new participants introduced themselves: Fred Balistreri of Applied Simulation Technology was involved in the early development of IBIS and expressed his company's continued interest in IBIS. Raj Raghuram will be the representive calling in to replace long term representative Dileep Divekar. Matthew Flora just joined Hyperlynx is and responsible for IBIS model developemnt and the Visual IBIS Editor. Frank Kern of Intel is with the XTG Group responsible for issuing new generation IBIS (and Quad) models and also supports the hardware team using IBIS models to convey information. He expressed concern regarding no Version 3.0 Golden Parser to validate IBIS models. Rob Wenzel of Motorola just joined to replace Ahmed Omer and will be suporting internal Spice to IBIS conversions. Dave Baranauskas (and later Doug Wallace) called from Dell Computer. Dave has several years experience using IBIS. His interest is to leverage IBIS for Signal Integrity and timing issues. He expressed a strong vested interest in IBIS and in requiring IBIS models for semiconductor vendors. (Dave verified Fran Hart formerly with 3M is with Dell.) MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Patti Rusher reported no membership change. She reported committee income of $11,750 and an existing net of $5,272 (down from $9,433 from the last minutes after some DAC expenses, reprint purchases, and other expenses. Bob Ross questioned whether credit was given for the latest official member. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S No Corrections. Stephen Peters reviewed the AR's. The major outstanding ones are for examples for the Cookbook and BIRDs and will be carried forward. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS Bob Ross reported everyone is back from vacation and thanks Stephen Peters and Syed Huq for helping out with the system administration tasks. Congratulations to Stephen Peters for the new addition Spencer James Peters. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Bob Ross reported that Howard Johnson's May 1997 Electronic Design article which references IBIS is availble from his site under Straight Talk for Serious Digital Designers, "Planning for Signal Integrity" under http://www.sigcon.com. Syed Huq reported on some EIA/IBIS Web page changes including roster updates and Version 3.0 access. NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE Bob Ross notes that these Web sites have added models: Cypress Semiconductor has added many more IBIS model for FCT octals and 16 bit logic, SRAMs, Programmable Logic, and Programmable Skew Clocks. IDT, Motorola and Texas Instruments have added IBIS models. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES Bob Ross - East Coast IBIS Users Group Meeting Patti Rusher - EIA Matters - Budget, Design Automation 98 Booth. EAST COAST IBIS USERS GROUP Bob Ross reported that Dr. Ed Sayre of North East Systems Associates (NESA) is investigating hosting an East Coast IBIS Users meeting in Massachusettes. The tentative date will be Thursday, September 18, 1997 since Bob and others will be at the PCB East conference on September 17. Bob suggested Ed send out information on the IBIS reflectors to see who might be interested. The agenda or topics still needs to be developed. EIA IBIS MATTERS Patti Rusher indicated that we need to work with EIA concerning next years budget to cover some anticipated Writer/Developer expenses. Patti will not be at the PCB East Conference, but will be in a Tokyo IEC meeting. The EIA/IBIS committee plans to participate in the DAC98 Standards Booth. The price/level of committment has not been determined since the possibility of having actual IBIS demonstrations means more booth space alocation. This would also have to be considered in the budgeting discussions. INTERNATIONAL PROGRESS - 93/46/NP (IBIS Version 2.1) - Patti Rusher will check the status at a meeting on August 21, 1997 prior to the Tokyo meeting. - 93/60/NP (IBIS Models and EMC Simulation) - Patti will check the status at the Tokyo meeting through contacting Jean LeBrun, the IEC subcommittee chairman. - EIAJ III (I/O Interface Model for ICs - Bob Ross reported no know progress, but based on the presentations at the IBIS Summit, we can expect another release in September along with a Package Committee release. Fred Balistreri reports that simulation algorithms have been incorporated and some models have been developed. EDITING COMMITTEE Stephen Peters reported no further progress on editing IBIS Version 3.0 for clarity since Bob Ross and Stephen were out. Bob reviewed briefly that the intent was to make IBIS Version 3.0 more readable by considering doing the following: Table of Contents and Section/Chapter headings Consistency of Words as suggested by Ogawa-san of the EIAJ subcommittee Tree diagram BNF Syntax Some Cookbook details added. Clarifications (BIRD44, etc.) Bob and Stephan still plan a first pass to be put in the work in progress directory (wip). After this first pass is completed, several issues will be addressed: Format - Syed Huq feels that a format other than ASCII text such as Word, HTML, Postscript will allow better graphics and presentation Professional Support - Use a professional writer. Editing Meeting - Set up a committee for an all day meeting. The existing AR is still in effect and a new one is added for Stephen and Bob to generate a first pass editorial review copy. AR - Bob Ross generate and post a BNF for IBIS Version 3.0 (and IBIS Version 3.0 ratification AR). AR - Stephen Peters and Bob Ross generate an editorial revision of Version 3.0 and place it in the eda.org/pub/ibis/wip directory. VERSION 3.1 PARSER Four individuals responded to Stephen Peters' request for development posting. Bob Ross suggested that Stephen, Bob and Syed Huq review the candidates and issue a request for a bid regarding time/money based on the scope of the project. Chris Rokusek emphasized that the development should start and be based on the existing ibischk2+ source code with some data checking messages. He also stated that the existing messages be retained because they are used in some system. In response to a question, Bob stated that there is no further ibis_chk (for Version 1.1 or ibischk2+) development planned. Bug8 deferred one correction that existed in all parsers until Version 3.0 development. Syed Huq brought up the fact that some of the candidates may need to review the source code to provide the bid. Bob Ross agreed and would plan to provide the source code for the purposes of providing a bid only. Mike Flora asked how to get the ibischk2+ source code and Bob responded that companies (such as Hyperlynx) who have paid for the licence can get it directly from Bob Ross or Chris Rokusek. AR - Bob Ross, Stephen Peters, and Syed Huq consider the candidates and issue a document for the selected candidates to provide a time/money bid for the ibischk3 parser development project. LEGAL IBIS VERSION 3.0 FILES Chris Rokusek indicated that Jon Powell had concerns about the legality of producing IBIS Version 3.0 file with having a parser to validate them and without formal EIA ratification of IBIS Version 3.0. This generated a long discussion and debate. Some issues related to whether the files should be marked PRELIMINARY or EXPERIMENTAL in place of 3.0 for the [IBIS Ver] keyword. Bob felt that the Version 3.0 format was official, so it is legal to generate IBIS Version 3.0 files. However, the consensus of everyone was to support adding some warning/disclaimer text to alert the user that the files were not officially validated and could have syntax errors. One commentor stated that even with the IBIS Version 2.1 parser, half of the public IBIS files have bad syntax or data. Patti Rusher reviewed the anticipated steps to reach standardization - Version 3.1 with editorial review and parser completion (hopefully), then submit to EIA for a 2 month letter ballot review. Based on a successful review and response to the contents, EIA would then ratify the document as a new Standard. Chris indicated that Jon will post a note on the subject to clarify his position and initiate discussion. COOKBOOK Stephen Peters reported that he has not received any examples. The AR's are still pending below. He would use the examples and augment them with comments. Stephen also mentioned that Frank Kern plans to add a mostly tutorial section explaining the structure (IV, VT data) and its rationale with respect to using behavioral models. Stephen raised the question whether the preliminary version of the Cookbook should be made available. After some discussion, the concensus was that it is a very useful document even at this early stage. We need clear indication that this is preliminary and updates should be tracked by version number. Two ARs were generated to for this to occur. All existing example AR's are carried forward. AR - The following people have volunteered to supply examples Steve Kaufer/Hyperlynx -- Example 1 Arpad Muranyi - Example 2 Stephen Peters - Example 3 AR - D.C Sessions. Supply a paragraph or two explaining the best way to modify a SPICE transistor model to get realistic power and ground clamp information AR - Bob Ross. Supply the text for the section "Diode Transient Time Data" AR - Syed Huq. Review and expand (if necessary) Section 3.3. on "Obtaining I/V and Switching Information via Lab Measurement". AR - Bob Ross submit an example of a Series MOSFET component. AR - Stephen Peters with Bob Ross put a copy of the Cookbook in the eda.org/pub/ibis/wip directory after appropriate Version number and preliminary disclaimers are added. AR - Syed Huq provide a link to access the Cookbook document from the official EIA/IBIS Web Site when the Cookbook is uploaded. S2IBIS2 ISSUES (& NT) Bob Ross reported that the NT versions of s2ibis have not yet been put on the VeriBest Web site. So the AR is still active. AR - Ian Dodd put s2ibis_ver1.3 and s2ibis_ver2.1 for Windows on the VeriBest Web site. BIRD42.3 - MODELING CURRENT WAVEFORMS Bob Ross summarized the status of BIRD42.3. It was not approved at the June IBIS ratification meeting because of some controversial aspects. There was no further discussion. The AR is still considered open. AR - D.C. Sessions and Kumar get together and provide an example showing where the rising and falling waveform tables do not result in correct results. BIRD44 - INTERPRETATION OF MIN/MAX/WEAK/STRONG DATA Bob Ross proposed that BIRD44 be put in the Editorial Committee portion of the Agenda since it is an editorial clarification. As discussed at the previous meeting, the contents of BIRD44 will be taken into account as part of the first editorial pass of Version 3.0. It will continue to remain open. SWITCHING TERMINATORS Arpad Muranyi has no further work in this area, but now has more time to work on it. In response to a question by Dave Baranauskas regarding whether this was an extension of the IBIS scope, Arpad indicated that the funtionality was not for a new type of terminator, but was for some internal I/O buffer electrical characterization that is new. (Some overview discussions are on the FTP sight under summits for the January 1997 IBIS Open Forum Summit meeting.) MISCELLANEOUS DISCUSSION The technical content of the meeting was concluded ahead of schedule. Bob Ross opened the meeting up to discussions and questions on all subjects. As indicated above, the presentations of several previous IBIS Summits where the focus was primarily information presentations are available at the eda.org site (same as vhdl.org): http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/summits. They are also available using anonymous FTP at this location. The BIRD (Buffer Issue Resolution Document) process was reviewed by Bob and Arpad Muranyi as the method used by the committee to revise the standard. A key aspect is that we will argue solid proposals based on the wording of the proposed revision. BIRDs go through revisions based on the discussions. They are available from the eda.org/pub/ibis/birds site and through other links. Dave Baranauksas asked for more details on the French IBIS Modeling and EMC proposal and Bob responded that he was seeking details as well. Dave also asked about the EIAJ III work since he had received the synopsys document from Fred Balistreri. Bob and other discussed aspects of this proposal including the fact the transistor devices were based on the source table information. This is more accurate than the (arbitrary level) equation data, but does not give some parameter sensitivites (such as temperature) that are taken into account in the assumed equations. NEXT MEETING: The next meeting is on Friday, September 5, 1997, 8:00 A.M. to 9:55 A.M. following the Labor day weekend. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 603-2523, Fax (503) 639-3469 bob@icx.com Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix 10220 SW Nimbus Ave, K4, Portland, OR 97223 VICE CHAIR: Syed Huq (408) 721-4874, Fax: (408) 721-4785 huq@rockie.nsc.com Staff Applications Engineer, National Semiconductor, M/S A-2595 2900 Semiconductor Drive, Santa Clara, CA 95052 SECRETARY: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-4515 sjpeters@ichips.intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF1-56 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, Oregon 97124-5961 LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jonp@qdt.com Senior Scientist, Viewlogic (formerly Quad Design) 1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@vhdl.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@vhdl.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@vhdl.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@vhdl.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@vhdl.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@vhdl.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@vhdl.org To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on vhdl.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eia.org Check the pub/ibis directory on vhdl.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. "IBIS Spoken Here" placards are available from Jon Powell (jonp@qdt.com) for use at trade shows. ==============================================================================