Date: 5/30/00 SUBJECT: 5/26/00 EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 2000 PARTICIPANTS LIST: 3Com Roy Leventhal* Agilent (EEsof, etc.) Mark Chang Applied Simulation Technology Raj Raghuram*, Norio Matsui, Fred Balistreri Avanti Nikolai Bannov Cadence Design Mike LaBonte*, Todd Westerhoff, Ian Dodd*, Donald Telian, Patrick Dos Santos Cisco Systems Syed Huq, Irfan Elahi, John Fisher Compaq [Bob Haller], Peter LaFlamme, Ron Bellomio, Shafier Rahman, Doug Burns Cypress (Rajesh Manapat) EMC Corporation (Fabrizio Zanella), Fairchild Semiconductor Craig Klem HyperLynx (& Pads Software) Matthew Flora*, Kellee Crisafulli, Gene Garat, John Angulo*, Al Davis, Lynne Green IBM Michael Cohen*, Greg Edlund Incases Werner Rissiek Innoveda (Viewlogic Systems) Chris Rokusek, Guy de Burgh*, Jun Tian, Cary Mandel, Brad Griffin, (Jon Powell) Intel Corporation Stephen Peters, Arpad Muranyi, Will Hobbs, Richard Mellitz LSI Logic (Larry Barnes) Mentor Graphics (& Veribest) Bob Ross*, Tom Dagostino, Malcolm Ash, Kim Owen, Jean Oudinot, Sherif Hammad, Hazam Hegazy, Weston Beal Mitsubishi Shahab Ahmed Molex Incorporated Gus Panella Motorola Ron Werner* National Semiconductor Milt Schwartz* North East Systems Associates Edward Sayre, Tony Sinker Nortel Networks Steve Coe, Calvin Trowell, Hassan Ali Philips Semiconductor D.C. Sessions (& VLSI Technology) Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Siemens AG Bernhard Unger, Gerald Bannert SiQual Scott McMorrow, Wis Macomson Texas Instruments Stephen Nolan, Ramzi Ammar, Mac McCaughey, Thomas Fisher, Jean-Claude Perrin, Jean-Yves Oberle Time Domain Analysis Systems Dima Smolyansky, Steven Corey Tyco Electronics (AMP) (Russell Moser) Via Technologies (Weber Chuang) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 2000: Actel Corp. Silvia Montoya Advansis Mikio Kiyono Aerospatiale Matra CCR Lionel Dreux, Julien Boullie Alcatel (Lannion, Bell) Daniel Peron, Steven Criel Brocade Communications Robert Badal EIA Cecilia Fleming Fraunhofer Institute Michael Kurten Jet Propulsion Lab John Treichlew Hewlett Packard Paul Gregory Rockwell Collins Ron Hau Signals & Systems Engineering Tom Hawkins ST Micorelectronics Fabrice Boissiere, Pierre Saintot Sun Microsystems Victor Chang Thomson-CSF Savenrio Lerose, Pascal Vaslin, Thierry Zak, Sylvie Lasserre Transfer Hans Klos, Wilco Hamhuis Xilinx, Inc. Susan Wu In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode June 8, 2000 - DAC 2000 IBIS Summit Meeting (No Bridge) All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM No new participants. MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Bob Ross reported that we are dropping two members from the list and following up on payment details for two others. We expect 31 paid members so far this year. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S The May 5, 2000 IBIS Minutes were approved. The AR's will be discussed during the meeting. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Bob Ross reported that "Designers Using IBIS Models to Resolve Signal Integrity Issues" by Paul Dewell exists on pages 29-32 of May/June 2000 issue of Electronics Journal (an advertising supplement to EETimes and possibly other publications). It contains a sidebar by Arpad Muranyi and references the IBIS Home Page and the DesignCon 2000 presentation by Syed Huq. A link exist to the article (split into two lines to avoid mailer truncation): http://www.avanticorp.com /Avant!/EJ/Technical/Articles/Item/1,1058,201,00.html Bob also reported that Cecilia Fleming is still following up on possible EIA page based search engines for IBIS model location. NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE Bob Ross reported that a number of links have moved. Also he has located some other links: IBIS Models for Analog Devices exist at http://www.analog.com/techsupt/licensing/ibis/ IBIS models are found by searching IBIS for Conextent: http://www.conextent.com/ Intel references some Intel 21xxx Ethernet LAN controllers at: http://developer.intel.com/design/network/drivers/ibis.htm Integrated Device Technology Models exist under these links: http://www.idt.com/products/pages/FIFO_IBIS_p.html http://www.idt.com/products/pages/Logic_IBIS_p.html http://www.idt.com/products/pages/Multi-Port_IBIS_p.html http://www.idt.com/products/pages/Processors_IBIS_p.html http://www.idt.com/products/pages/SRAM_IBIS_p.html Some new sites from Motorola and On Semiconductor are: http://www.mot.com/SPS/MCTG/MDAD/switch/ under the Tools, ATMC and WarpLink(tm) links and also http://www.onsemi.com/pub/prod/0,1824,products1_models,00.html for LCX. IBIS Models for Texas Instruments for the FCT family from Cypress and Flat Display exist at: http://www.ti.com/sc/docs/tools/logic/models/fct_ibis.htm http://www.ti.com/sc/docs/tools/msp/intrface/serdes/lvds/serdes.htm IBIS models for TranSwitch Corporation: http://www.transwitch.com/support/supp_software.shtml Ron Werner asked why we are presenting this information. Bob commented that this is mostly for information and to show support of IBIS. References to magazine articles also are given for the same reason. However, we also have links to free, public IBIS model sites from the EIA IBIS home page. Bob also noted that other models can often be found through local sales channels to these sites and for models from other several other companies as well. So it is always a good idea to contact the company when IBIS models cannot be located through Web links. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES Roy Leventhal - FPGA Pinouts in IBIS Models (introduced at the end of the meeting.) INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS - IEC 62014-1 (IBIS Version 3.2) - Bob Ross reported that Cecilia Fleming will be sending shortly the new document header information needed to release the document to Bob Ross for review (by the IBIS officers). - pr EIAJ ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits (IMIC) - Bob Ross reported that he will meet with Chairperson Dr. Hideki Fukuda plans to attend the IBIS Summit Meeting on June 8, 2000 and will be meeting together prior to the meeting. - IEC PWI 93-1 Models of Integrated Circuits for EMI Behavioral Simulation (formerly designated as IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation) - Bob Ross had no further report. We are waiting for revised documents that are planned to be delivered about this time for uploading. - JEDEC JC-16 - As previously reported, Bob Ross indicated that the JEDEC group is holding a meeting that conflicts with the IBIS Summit Meeting. However, D.C. Sessions may fly from Seattle to attend the IBIS Summit Meeting. Bob also noted that the IBISCenter utility that was uploaded as part of the JEDEC and IBIS training class now includes support for Solaris, Sun OS and NT operating systems. DAC 2000 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING Bob Ross gave the background information on the IBIS Summit Meeting held at the Hyatt Regency Hotel about six blocks from the Los Angeles Convention Center where the Design Automation Conference (DAC 2000) is being held. The IBIS Summit Meeting is scheduled on Thursday, June 8, 2000 after the trade show portion of DAC 2000 (held Monday through Wednesday, June 5-7). The room is scheduled for all day. Guy de Burgh reported he sent out third announcement notice and has about 20 to 25 signups. Bob stated we are on track for the typical 25 or more actual attendees. Bob stated that the main topics planned so far are: Election of Officers for 2000 - 2001 Connector Specification Discussion IBIS Version 4.0 Issues Future IBIS Progress and Issues Bob listed some expected presentations and discussions: IBIS Report - Bob Ross, Mentor Graphics Connector Specification, Kellee Crisafulli, HyperLynx IBIS Future Directions Overview - Stephen Peters, Intel Overview of XML - Mike LaBonte, Cadence Macro Language - Al Davis, HyperLynx Introduction to Equation Based Analog Modeling in Standard HDL Languages (VHDL_AMS and Verilog) - Kenneth Bakalar, Mentor Graphics Bob stated that the formal Meeting Agenda will be sent out on Thursday, June 1, 2000. We plan to have ample time for interactive discussions. ELECTION OF IBIS OFFICERS FOR 2000 - 2001 Bob Ross commmented that in response to the suggestion to make the election more visible, nominations should be opened perhaps two teleconference meetings before the IBIS Summit Meeting. This year we are partially responding to the suggestion. While our processes are free and open, people who might want to become involved may not be aware of how easy it is. Ron Werner felt that we do not really need to resort to very formal processes (e.g., publishing duties, asking for position statements, sending out ballots, etc.) since active participant should have a general idea of the tasks and processes. Bob stated that nominations are welcome at the IBIS Summit meeting and that the elections will be starting from the Chair position, and move one position at a time. So candidates not elected can still be nominated for another available position. Furthermore, a person can be nominated for several positions, but once elected, that person is removed from consideration for the remaining positions. We are now accepting nominations (including self nominations) for people whether or not they are able to attend the meeting for one or more positions. We just need to know prior to the election if each candidate is willing to serve. Bob asked for nominations. The following people are officially nominated: Chair: Bob Ross, Mentor Graphics, Stephen Peters, Intel Vice Chair: Stephen Peters, Intel Secretary: Guy de Burgh, Innoveda Postmaster: John Angulo, HyperLynx Webmaster: Syed Huq, Cisco Systems Librarian: Jon Powell, Innoveda, Mike LaBonte, Cadence You are welcome to e-mail any additional nominations before the meeting to Guy de Burgh (address at the bottom). PCB EAST 2000 PRELIMINARY IBIS SUMMIT MEETING Bob Ross stated that preliminary reservations have been made for an IBIS Summit Meeting in Worcester, Massachusetts co-located with the PCB East Conference show. The preliminary information exists on the Upcoming events link of the EIA IBIS home page: IBIS SUMMIT: Thursday, September 14, 2000 8:30 AM to 5 PM (tentative) LOCATION: Crowne Plaza Worcester (About 3 blocks from PCBEAST 2000) Worcester Metro 10 Lincoln Square Worcester, MA 01608 SPONSORSHIP: NESA and to be determined CONTACTS: Kathy Breda for IBIS Summit Meeting PCB Conference East Location: Worcester Centrum Centre, Worcester, MA Mike LaBonte indicated that Cadence plans to be a co-sponsor. ACCURACY HANDBOOK No report. COOKBOOK STATUS No report. IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION Matthew Flora reported that no new models have been received. CONNECTOR PROPOSAL REVIEW (CONTINUED) Bob Ross reported that the Connector Specification Working Group has been meeting regularly on May 8, 2000, May 11, 2000, and May 23, 2000 to continue to resolve technical issues. The next meeting is scheduled Tuesday, May 30, 2000. Ian Dodd briefly reported on the last meeting. Participants included Ian, Bob, Kellee Crisafulli, and Gus Panella. Work is continuing on describing and clarifying the matrices representing connectors including lumped versus distributed (transmission line) interpretations and also on pin number versus physical location details. IBIS FUTURES (IBIS-X, API, BIRDxx) John Angulo reported on a meeting held Thursday, May 25, 2000. John, Al Davis, Bob Ross, Mike LaBonte, and Stephen Peters attended. John reported that this meeting was a follow up of the meeting held on March 30, 2000. At that time a goal for a future IBIS was to reduce the need for new keywords when new component families and feature are introduced. The direction includes supporting a nodal description language. Supporting IMIC was discussed. Also, behavioral level modules are still needed for capturing functionality and while protecting intellectual property. The new structure could support analog and mixed analog and digital simulation. One need is to include pin to pad modeling is planned. Finally, Al Davis is continuing to work on a macro language. Some of this will be reported and discussed at the IBIS Summit Meeting. After the IBIS Summit Meeting, Stephen Peters will be on a 10 week sabbatical. However, Mike LaBonte indicated that he wants to conduct meetings on a bi-weekly basis after the IBIS Summit meeting and is currently checking if every other Wednesday at 10 AM West Coast time is available. TABLE LENGTH REDUCTION Bob Ross noted that the 100 point limit topic was introduced briefly by D.C. Sessions at the May 5, 2000 meeting. Discussion continued on the IBIS reflector regarding algorithms to reduce a larger number of data point to 100 points. IBISCHK3 BUG TRACKING - BUG34 - No Error Reported for Missing V/I Tables in Output Buffers Matthew Flora just issued an update of BUG34 (during the meeting) for simplified and revised messages. The discussion was deferred until a later meeting. - BUG41 - Issue Warning Instead of Error for Common Differential Pin Bob Ross noted that BUG41 was introduced in response to the Differential Input Specification for Single-ended Input technical discussion started at the May 5, 2000 meeting. BUG41 allows relaxing the ibischk3 parser testing of [Diff Pin] to allow a pin to be listed as in for more than one differential buffer. Currently an Error message is issued. BUG41 would change this to a Warning message. This is in response to the fact that some SSTL-2 input buffers are actually constructed using differential circuits but with the non-inverting pins tied to a common VREF pin. Noise on the VREF line and affects output delay. This noise could be analyzed by treating each input as a differential input. Currently, ibischk3 prohibits specifying pins in this manner. However, while this application was not anticipated, it is not explicitly prohibited in IBIS Version 3.2. Bob listed some arguments some pro and con arguments that he sent to the IBIS reflector and noted that other discussions have occurred. More BUG41 discussion occurred at the meeting. Michael Cohen suggested that we postpone a decision on BUG41 so that the points could be considered offline. Bob stated that we will revisit BUG41 at a future meeting. Bob classified BUG41 as ENHANCEMENT, MEDIUM, OPEN (with the action to be determined). - BUG42 - Warning Message for Outputs with thresholds Needed Bob Ross introduced BUG42. Currently some subparameters that do nothing for the specified Model_type can still be included under [Model]. The ibischk3 parser will not issue a Warning or an Error message. BUG42 proposes issuing a Warning message when the Vinh and Vinl thresholds are included in a model that is not Input* or I/O* (no input functionality that would use the input thresholds). This alerts the developer and user of a potential problem that the Model_type may be wrong or the thresholds were included by mistake. Bob noted that the original purpose of ibischk was to test syntactical compliance. Syntactically correct extra information was not regarded as a problem. Michael Cohen suggested we also defer consideration of BUG42 since it had not been issued on the IBIS reflector. Bob classified BUG42 as ENHANCEMENT, LOW, and OPEN (with the action to be determined). BIRD61.1 - ENHANCED CHARACTERIZATION OF RECEIVERS Mike LaBonte noted that some e-mail discussion had occurred. Unfortunately, because of missed communication, a scheduled meeting was not held. Mike had voluteered to prototype BIRD61.1, but ran into interpretation difficulties regarding how to post process the data. Bob Ross noted that one approach was to use the data to create a model. We had not pursued BIRD61.1 after some other model approaches had been suggested in IBIS Summit meetings. So some of the concerns remained whether BIRD61.1 was structured to supply enough. Bob noted that an argument advanced in favor of continuing with BIRD61.1 was that having a partial solution was better than not having any short term solution. BIRD64.1 - PACKAGE MODE SELECTOR Not Discussed. BIRD65 - C_comp REFINEMENTS Bob Ross noted that since Arpad Muranyi could not attend this meeting, the discussion on BIRD65 is being deferred. BIRD66 - [Model Spec] Vref ADDITION Not discussed. NEW TECHNOLOGIES Bob Ross noted from previous discussions that we need still need to validate if the AVC family with voltage sensitive output impedance control circuitry can be modeled with existing IBIS Version 3.2. FPGA PINOUTS IN IBIS MODELS (New Topic) Roy Leventhal commented that IBIS models for FPGA parts typically include only the buffers with a skeleton component header. The actual pinout is needed for the part. Currently Roy solves the problem with one vendor by sending the vendor the required pinout information, and they then add it to the IBIS model and send the completed model back to Roy. Roy would like a statement in the IBIS Specification stating that each part needs a full component pinout. Bob Ross suggested that this could be accomplished through the BIRD process as an editorial change. It would not involve any technical or ibischk3 parser change. One possible location would be as another guideline in Section 3 for Syntax Rules and Guidelines. Roy stated that he plans to work on this within several months. Bob also noted that he still has some descriptive writeups sent by Roy from his presentation at the September 1999 IBIS Summit Meeting. The documents are used internally at 3Com to clarify IBIS Version 3.2. Bob preferred that the document use more IBIS models examples, but he still thinks that the writups are valuable. Some of the writeups are still contain company specific information. Bob plans to upload the most general one in the training directory in the IBIS FTP site. NEXT MEETING: The next meeting is the IBIS Summit Meeting on Thursday, June 8, 2000. No teleconference access is planned. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897 bob_ross@mentor.com Modeling Engineer, Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070 VICE CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-4515 sjpeters@ichips.intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF1-209 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, OR 97124-5961 SECRETARY: Guy de Burgh (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 gdeburgh@innoveda.com Senior Manager, Innoveda 1369 Del Norte Rd. Camarillo, CA 93010-8437 LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jpowell@innoveda.com Senior Scientist, Innoveda 1369 Del Norte Rd. Camarillo, CA 93010-8437 WEBMASTER: Syed Huq (408) 525-3399, Fax: (408) 526-5504 shuq@cisco.com Manager, Hardware Engineering, Cisco Systems 170 West Tasman Drive San Jose, CA 95134-1706 POSTMASTER: Matthew Flora (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008 mbflora@hyperlynx.com Senior Engineer, HyperLynx, Inc. 114715 N.E. 95th Street Redmond, WA 98052 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@eda.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@eda.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@eda.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@eda.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@eda.org To report ibischk2/3 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt, /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, & /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eia.org/eig/ibis/ibis.htm Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. ==============================================================================