DATE: 9/4/01 SUBJECT: August 31, 2001 EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 2001 PARTICIPANTS LIST: 3Com (& CommWorks) Roy Leventhal Ansoft Corporation (Eric Bracken) Apple Computer John Figueroa Applied Simulation Technology [Raj Raghuram], Norio Matsui, Fred Balistreri Avanti (Chen Hongyu) Cadence Design [Ian Dodd], Patrick Dos Santos, Heiko Dudek, Lynne Green*, Lance Wang* Cisco Systems Syed Huq, Lungfu Chen Cypress Semiconductor (Rajesh Manapat) EMC Corporation Brian Arsenault, Jinhua Chen Fairchild Semiconductor Adam Tambone Huawei Technologies Rachild Chen IBM Michael Cohen, Greg Edlund*, Wes Martin, Yeon-Chang Hahm, Bill DeVey, Pravin Patel* Innoveda (& HyperLynx) Guy de Burgh*, John Angulo*, Cary Mandel, Matthew Flora, Steve Kaufer Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Arpad Muranyi*, Dave Lorang, Michael Mirmak*, Qinglun Chen, Will Hobbs, Wei-hsing Huang LSI Logic Larry Barnes Mentor Graphics Bob Ross*, Tom Dagostino*, Chris Reid, Mike Donnelly, Hazem Hegazy, Tony Dunbar, Griff Derryberry, Dan Lake, Sherif Hammad, Mohammed Korany, Weston Beal, Chris Swaim, Ali Samii, Eric Ronger, Karine Loudet, Daisaku Shiga, Kenji Kushima, Ian Dodd* Micron Technology Randy Wolff*, Yong Phan* Mitsubishi Pat Hefferan Molex Incorporated Gus Panella, Brian O'Malley National Semiconductor Milt Schwartz North East Systems Associates Edward Sayre Philips Semiconductor Zack Ciccone, Rob Mataheroe Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Signal Integrity Software Douglas Burns, Barry Katz, Walter Katz Sigrity Raj Raghuram* SiQual Scott McMorrow, Rob Hinz, Bernard Voss, Chris Brewster Texas Instruments Thomas Fisher, Stephen Nolan, Ramzi Ammar, Jean Claude Perrin, Moshiul Haque Time Domain Analysis Systems Dima Smolyansky, Steve Corey Tyco Electronics (Russell Moser) Via Technologies (Weber Chuang) Zuken (& Incases) John Berrie, Ralf Bruening OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 2001: Actel Corporation Silvia Montoya Acuson Kim Helliwell AMCC Jeff Smith ASIS Ltd David Wright Brocade Communications Robert Badal BMW Friedrich Hasinger Cereva Networks Bob Haller Compaq [Peter LaFlamme], Ron Bellomio, Quang Dam, Bill Ham EADS Airbus Industry Claude Huet (Aerospatiale) EFM Ekkehard Miersch, Horle Raines EIA Cecilia Fleming Ericsson Radio Systems Anders Ekholm FCI Sercu Stefaan Foundary Networks Bertram Chan Framatom Conectors Danny Morlion Fraunhofer Institute Mariusz Faferko, Peter Kralicek Reliability and Integration Fujitsu Ltd Tadashi Arai, Takeshi Murakami Heidelberger Druchmaschinen AG Wolfgang Kleinfeldt Hyundai Electronics Jongho Kang Idaho State University Al Davis Infineon Technologies Christian Sporrer Intrinsix Corporation Steven Chin Motorola (Rick Kingen) National Institute of Applied Etienne Sicard Science (INSA) Nokia Tapani von Ravner, Mika Castren, Janne Uusitalo Nortel Networks Calvin Trowell Oak Technology Darmin Jin Plexus Technology Group Joseph Socha Siemens (& Automotive) AG Bernhard Unger, Helmut Katzier, Katja Koller, Wolfram Meyer, Eckhard Lenski, Gerald Bannert, Burkhard Muller, Christian Marot, Manfred Maurer, Amir Motamedi, Hans Pichlmaier Sintecs Hans Klos STMicroelectronics Peter Hirt, Fabrice Boissieres Sun Adrian Udenze Toshiba Corp. Hirokaza Kato, Yuichi Koga, Toshio Sudo Xilinx Susan Wu In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode Thursday, September 13, 2001 IBIS Summit Meeting, No Phone Bridge All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum, and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Stephen Peters and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ----------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM No new participants MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Stephen Peters reported that we have 31 new members, with one more prospect. We had projected 30 members for the year, so we are ahead of budget. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S The August 10, 2001 IBIS Minutes were approved without change. The ARs were discussed during the meeting. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Bob Ross noted that Syed Huq and Cecilia Fleming did several Web updates (Roster, Upcoming Events). A top-level "Ver 4.0 Work In Progress" link on the web site has been updated with the latest Ver 4.0 draft. This unofficial draft includes the recently passed Birds 70.5 and 71. Bob reported that Zuken is offering a free "ibisinf" utility that works on several platforms and can be downloaded from: http://www.zuken.com/ibis/ or http://www.zuken.com/solutions_board_ibis.asp Stephen Peters asked what it produces. Bob responded that it provides model information including subparameter values (e.g., Vinh, Vmeas), I-V and V-T table informations (e.g, R_fixture value of each table). It also provides component information including how many pins are modeled. Bob reported that Syed added a link to this under the FREE Tools section of the IBIS Home page. Bob reported that Roy Leventhal is checking and updating the links on the Models page. Stephen added that he has invited a newly formed Signal Integrity Technical Committee within the EMC Society (and announced on the SI reflector) to inform the IBIS community of its activities. NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE No new models or library updates were reported. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES None INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS - JEITA ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits (IMIC) - No report. - IEC 62014-3 (ICEM) Integrated Circuit Electromagnetic Model Proposal (formerly, IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation) - Stephen Peters reported the Jean-Claude Perrin sent him an email stating that the document is now officially stored as an IEC technical document. Bob Ross will ask Cecilia Fleming if she can find the link. - JEDEC JC-16 - Modeling and Testing - No report. - T10, Project 1414-DT - SCSI Signal Modeling (a Technical Committee of the National Committee for Information Technology (NCITS)) - No report. PCB CONFERENCE EAST 2001 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING PLANS Stephen Peters reported that an IBIS Summit Meeting is planned for Thursday, September 13, 2001 in Worcester, Massachusetts at the Crowne Plaza Hotel near the PCB Conference East 2001 show. The meeting follows the day after the trade show portion of the show. The Upcoming events link of the IBIS home page already contains the sign-up information and hotel information. Free lunch and refreshments are included. The third announcement has been sent out. Bob Ross reports that we still expect about 20 people. Some local people have not signed up yet, and Stephen urged those that have not signed up to do so. To date, four presentations are planned (titles may change): "Modeling the Radiated Emission of Micro-controllers", Etienne Sicard, National Institute of Applied Science (INSA) in France "A Proposal for s2ibis3", Michael Steer, North Carolina State University "Power/Ground Simulation with IBIS Models and Pin Mapping Issues", Raj Raghuram, Sigrity, Inc. "From Model Creator to Model User", Bob Haller, Cereva Networks Stephen added these presentations from the Working Groups: "Progress and Update in the Connector Specification", Stephen Peters, Intel "Progress and Issues in IBIS-X", Stephen Peters, Intel "IBIS-X Primitives and Example", Lynne Green, Cadence Design Bob added later that we will work with Stephen and Kathy Breda and send out an agenda on Thursday, September 6, 2001. He will also work with the presenters to get the presentations in by Friday, September 7 for copying. Otherwise the presenters should expect to bring 30 copies. Bob also added that the sponsors to date are Mentor Graphics, NESA, the IBIS Users Group, and the IBIS Open Forum. DESIGNCON 2002 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING Stephen Peters reported on the plans for the IBIS Summit Meeting scheduled on Monday, January 28, 2002 associated with DesignCon 2002 in Santa Clara, California. We will an Associate Sponsor. A large meeting room and refreshments will be provided. We will also plan on a booth, and Guy de Burgh will be handling the arrangements. Innoveda will be providing the backdrop. Stephen reported that National Semiconductor will sponsor the lunch, as before. We might require a signup for lunch this time to keep the costs reasonable. Most of the initial plans are complete. We will be sending out the meeting announcements and call for presentations later this year. IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION John Angulo reported that Texas Instrument model has been sent out for review. Another model has been received and John will forward it to Bob Ross. Bob also stated that he will update the IBIS home page email link with his email address. John also mentioned that Jon Powell of Innoveda has expressed an interest in taking on the IBIS Model Review function. John Angulo will follow up. MAJORDOMO UPDATE John Angulo reported that the ibis@eda.org list is now propagating fully. Stephen Peters asked if posters still need to copy the ibis-users reflector when they post to the main IBIS relector. After a short discussion we agreed that this procedure was no longer needed. John took the AR to issue a note that effect to the reflector. John then reported that we still have some archive difficulties linking to *.txt attachments (this needs to done manually) and with ASCII formatted data (the white space information is hard to restore). We are working on these issues. Bob Ross added that we have been moving the location under the IBIS FTP site and plan to open up another archive that currently only the system administrators can read. That may help resolve the white space archive problem. John added that Majordomo subscriptions require his approval, but unsubscribe requests are handled automatically. When this is accomplished we will plan to move the ibis-users list under Majordomo as well. This may possibly occur next week. CONNECTOR PROPOSAL REPORT Stephen Peters reported that connector meetings were held August 14, 21 and the 28, with the next one scheduled for Sept 4. The major topic at these meetings have been understanding the three different ways a connector can be described and which keywords apply in which cases. In the course of these discussions we simplified some keywords and eliminated some others. The connector committee also uncovered an issue with extracting cascaded matrixes that effects pin order to matrix row mapping. This will require additional work to solve. No connector meeting is scheduled for September 11. IBIS FUTURES REPORT Stephen Peters reported that the IBIS Futures group meet on August 16, 23 and 30 with the next meeting scheduled for Sept. 6. The Futures group has been concentrating on transmission line matrix format as well as some documentation issues. Stephen also reported that a proposal has been made to the IBIS Futures group to incorporate the IBIS-X 'define' functionality directly into the current IBIS data template via a BIRD, thus creating a relatively straightforward path for adoption of IBIS-X and the macro language into current IBIS. This BIRD would be issued sometime after IBIS 4.0 was voted on by the IBIS Open Forum (i.e. it would not effect the current progress towards IBIS 4.0). The Futures committee accepted the proposal as the best way to move forward with IBIS-X. Because of the IBIS east summit, no futures committee meeting is scheduled for September 13. BIRD72 - ACCOMMODATING PMOS AND NMOS//PMOS SERIES FET MODELS Tom Dagostino introduced BIRD72 by reporting that he has created Switch models from measurement. IBIS Version 3.2 assumes that the Series MOSFET is an N channel device. Tom has observed P channel and parallel P/N channel paths. Warning and Error messages are now generated for I-V tables for such devices. BIRD72 contains some changes in the notation and equations that allow for describing these additional I-V tables. The ibischk3 parser would be revised so that Error messages are not issued for decreasing currents. Stephen Peters wanted some clarification regarding the Vgs and Voltage. Tom responded that for P/N MOSFET configurations, the gate voltage was ambiguous. So Voltage is used in the table, and the Vgs reference is removed. Lynne Green wanted to know if a different I-V table was needed, and Tom responded that the same I-V table is used. Raj Raghuram questioned whether the tables worked for enhanced and depletion mode FETs. Tom thought that the I-V tables should still represent the data. Bob Ross noted that there were a few editorial corrections needed. Stephen stated that with some clarifications, a revised BIRD72.1 might be ready for a vote in October, 2001. AR - Tom Dagostino will issue BIRD72.1 with the discussed editorial changes and clarifications. BIRD73 - FALL BACK SUBMODEL Bob Ross introduced BIRD73 by noting that IBIS Version 3.2 does not cover the AVC technology devices offered by about four manufacturers. This technology has a stage turn off during the transition to weaken the overall driver at the end. This weaker driver may have an output resistance that provides a better match to the transmission line load. Bob stated that the existing Bus Hold submodel works in the opposite manner. It can be triggered to provide a stronger drive. So a new Fall Back submodel is introduced. One complication is that the state changes for turning off a device are more difficult to describe. The SIMULATOR RISING CYCLE: and SIMULATOR FALLING CYCLE: tables in the documentation attempts to do this. Both a rising or falling edge transition and a voltage trigger may cause a buffer state change. The table attempts to characterize what the model will do under all conditions including an ambiguous initial state. Bob indicated that the example really illustrates an application with ideal 50 Ohm submodels configured as Open_drain and Open_source models. This assures that the off state is also a high-Z state that provides no load. He also noted that the V_trigger_* values can be sent out of range to assure no unwanted triggering can occur. Unlike the Bus Hold submodel, the Off_delay subparameter is not defined. Stephen Peters noted that BIRD73 incorrectly copied the Fall Back example as the existing Bus Hold example. Bob will correct this. He will also make a correction to an Off_delay example. Bob also noted that BIRD73 is a candidate for prototyping in the macro language. Stephen also suggested adding a "state" table to the Bus hold example. AR - Bob Ross will issue BIRD73.1 with the discussed corrections and changes. IBISCHK3 BUG TRACKING STATUS Bob Ross reported that Atul Agarwal has started work on fixing BUGs 48 - 56. Bob has provided more information on BUG54. The expectation is that ibischk3 Version 3.2.8 will be available by the end of September 2001. BUG59 - Crash with Decimal Points for [Package] Subparameters Per the discussion at the last meeting, Bob Ross reported that John Angulo validated that the parser did crash under Windows 2000. Bob proposed that we upgrade the classification from ANNOYING, LOW, OPEN to MODERATE, LOW, OPEN. We still may need Innoveda to help identify the problem and provide a solution based on several Windows specific issues. Assuming that Atul does not have access to a Windows 2000 system, John Angulo took the AR to contact Matt Flora to see if he can help identify the fix. BUG60 - Incorrect Series Function Table Order Dependency Bob Ross introduced BUG60. An incorrect warning message is issued for [Series Switch Groups] entries that are not in the same sequence as the function_table_group entries. For example, a line On 1 2 3 4 / works, but On 2 1 3 4 / causes incorrect Warning messages related to undefined switch functions. The IBIS Version 3.2 specification does not require that the entries follow the same sequence. Bob proposed classifying this as MODERATE, MEDIUM, OPEN since the parser gives an incorrect Warning on a legal IBIS model. The short term work around is to carefully order the [Series Switch Groups] entries. After some discussion the group agreed with this classification. NEXT MEETING: The next meeting will be the IBIS Summit Meeting on Thursday, September 13, 2001 from 8:30 AM to 5:00 PM. No teleconference connection is planned. ============================================================================ NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-1831 stephen.peters@intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF4-215 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, OR 97124-5961 VICE CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897 bob_ross@mentor.com Modeling Engineer, Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070 SECRETARY: Guy de Burgh (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 gdeburgh@innoveda.com Senior Manager, Innoveda 1369 Del Norte Rd. Camarillo, CA 93010-8437 LIBRARIAN: Roy Leventhal (837) 797-2152, Fax: (847) 222-2799 roy_leventhal@3com.com Senior Engineer, CommWorks Corp. (a wholly owned 3Com subsidiary) 1800 W. Central Rd. Mt. Prospect, IL 60056-2293 WEBMASTER: Syed Huq (408) 525-3399, Fax: (408) 526-5504 shuq@cisco.com Manager, Hardware Engineering, Cisco Systems 170 West Tasman Drive San Jose, CA 95134-1706 POSTMASTER: John Angulo (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008 jangulo@innoveda.com Development Engineer, Innoveda 14715 N.E. 95th Street, Suite 200 Redmond, WA 98052 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: majordomo@eda.org In the body, for the IBIS Open Forum Reflector: subscribe ibis In the body, for the IBIS Users' Group Reflector: subscribe ibis-users Help and other commands: help ibis-request@eda.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@eda.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@eda.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@eda.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@eda.org To report ibischk2/3 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt, /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, and /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eigroup.org/ibis/ibis.htm Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. ============================================================================