DATE: 12/11/01 SUBJECT: December 7, 2001 EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 2001 PARTICIPANTS LIST: 3Com (& CommWorks) Roy Leventhal* Ansoft Corporation (Eric Bracken) Apple Computer John Figueroa Applied Simulation Technology [Raj Raghuram], Norio Matsui, Fred Balistreri Avanti (Chen Hongyu) Cadence Design [Ian Dodd], Patrick Dos Santos, Heiko Dudek, Lynne Green, Lance Wang Cisco Systems Syed Huq, Lungfu Chen Cypress Semiconductor (Rajesh Manapat) EMC Corporation Brian Arsenault, Jinhua Chen Fairchild Semiconductor Adam Tambone Huawei Technologies Rachild Chen IBM Michael Cohen, Greg Edlund, Wes Martin, Yeon-Chang Hahm, Bill DeVey, Pravin Patel Innoveda (& HyperLynx) Guy de Burgh*, John Angulo*, Cary Mandel, Matthew Flora, Steve Kaufer Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Arpad Muranyi*, Dave Lorang, Michael Mirmak, Qinglun Chen, Will Hobbs, Wei-hsing Huang LSI Logic Larry Barnes Mentor Graphics Bob Ross*, Tom Dagostino, Chris Reid, Mike Donnelly, Hazem Hegazy, Tony Dunbar, Griff Derryberry, Dan Lake, Sherif Hammad, Mohammed Korany, Weston Beal, Chris Swaim, Ali Samii, Eric Ronger, Karine Loudet, Daisaku Shiga, Kenji Kushima, Ian Dodd Micron Technology Randy Wolff*, Yong Phan, Tim Wells, Bob Cox Mitsubishi Pat Hefferan Molex Incorporated Gus Panella, Brian O'Malley Motorola (Rick Kingen) National Semiconductor Milt Schwartz* NEC Corporation (Akimoto Tetsuya) North East Systems Associates Edward Sayre Philips Semiconductor Zack Ciccone, Rob Mataheroe Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Siemens (& Automotive) AG Bernhard Unger, Helmut Katzier, Katja Koller, Wolfram Meyer, Eckhard Lenski, Gerald Bannert, Burkhard Muller, Christian Marot, Manfred Maurer, Amir Motamedi, Hans Pichlmaier Signal Integrity Software Douglas Burns, Barry Katz, Walter Katz Sigrity Raj Raghuram, Winson Yu SiQual Scott McMorrow, Rob Hinz, Bernard Voss, Chris Brewster Texas Instruments Thomas Fisher, Stephen Nolan, Ramzi Ammar, Jean Claude Perrin, Moshiul Haque Time Domain Analysis Systems Dima Smolyansky, Steve Corey Tyco Electronics (Russell Moser) Via Technologies (Weber Chuang) Zuken (& Incases) John Berrie, Ralf Bruening OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 2001: Actel Corporation Silvia Montoya Acuson Kim Helliwell AMCC Jeff Smith ASIS Ltd David Wright Brocade Communications Robert Badal BMW Friedrich Hasinger Cereva Networks Bob Haller Compaq [Peter LaFlamme], Ron Bellomio, Quang Dam, Bill Ham EADS Airbus Industry Claude Huet (Aerospatiale) EFM Ekkehard Miersch, Horle Raines EIA Cecilia Fleming* Ericsson Radio Systems Anders Ekholm FCI Sercu Stefaan Foundary Networks Bertram Chan Framatom Conectors Danny Morlion Fraunhofer Institute Mariusz Faferko, Peter Kralicek Reliability and Integration Fujitsu Ltd Tadashi Arai, Takeshi Murakami Heidelberger Druchmaschinen AG Wolfgang Kleinfeldt Hyundai Electronics Jongho Kang Idaho State University Al Davis Infineon Technologies Christian Sporrer Intrinsix Corporation Steven Chin KAW/USA Shinichi Maeda National Institute of Applied Etienne Sicard Science (INSA) Nokia Tapani von Ravner, Mika Castren, Janne Uusitalo North Carolina State U. Paul Franzon Nortel Networks Calvin Trowell Oak Technology Darmin Jin Plexus Technology Group Joseph Socha Sintecs Hans Klos STMicroelectronics Peter Hirt, Fabrice Boissieres Sun Adrian Udenze Toshiba Corp. Hirokaza Kato, Yuichi Koga, Toshio Sudo Xilinx Susan Wu In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode January 11, 2002 1-916-356-2663 2 8295945 (International Dial-in the same) January 28, 2002 IBIS Summit Meeting, Santa Clara California (No teleconference) All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum, and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Stephen Peters and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ----------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM No new attendees. MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Stephen Peters reported that these minutes contain the total participation list for year 2001. The list will be restarted with the first January 2002 meeting minutes. Currently we are at 34 official members. Cecilia Fleming reported that the invoices for year 2002 membership will be sent out to existing members and a few other companies that have expressed interest in joining. Bob Ross will be reviewing the list for the most recent addresses. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S The November 16, 2001 IBIS Minutes were approved without change. The ARs were discussed during the meeting. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Stephen Peters reported that Syed Huq updated the Roster pages for Compaq, Micron and STMicroelectronics. Stephen also noted that the roster page changes appearance depending on the internet browser used to view the page. Syed and Bob Ross tracked the problem down to the HTML code on the roster page and are currently working to fix the problem. NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE Roy Leventhal reported that this coming week he will update the Quicklogic link. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES Bob Ross requested that Bug 64 and Bug 65 be added to the agenda. INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS - JEITA ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits (IMIC) - Stephen Peters noted that in the last set of minutes Mr. Ito of Panasonic was mentioned under this agenda item. Stephen wanted to make clear that Mr. Ito is not the head of the IMIC sub-committee. In fact, with the acceptance of the IMIC specification by the JEITA committee the IMIC sub-committee is no longer in existence. After a brief discussion it was decided to drop the IMIC Standard agenda item from future IBIS meetings. - IEC 62014-3 (ICEM) Integrated Circuit Electromagnetic Model Proposal (formerly, IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation) - Stephen Peters and Bob Ross still have the action item to review the specification, and Stephen encouraged others to do so as well. Bob Ross noted that he will be putting the links to the ICEM documents (same links that were published in last meetings minutes) on the IBIS website. - JEDEC JC-16 - Modeling and Testing - No report. - T10, Project 1414-DT - SCSI Signal Modeling (a Technical Committee of the National Committee for Information Technology (NCITS)) - No report. IBIS SUMMIT MEETING AT DESIGNCON 2002 Stephen Peters reported on the plans for the IBIS Summit Meeting scheduled on Monday, January 28, 2002 associated with DesignCon 2002 in Santa Clara, California. Milt Schwartz sent out the initial announcement for signup and presentations. Guy de Burgh stated that Innoveda is still planning to provide the IBIS booth. Guy will send out a reflector note asking for member company logos on 1/4 inch, 8-1/2 by 11 foam board if the existing one has not changed or a new company wants to provide one for the IBIS booth backdrop. Stephen will provide Guy with an IBIS write-up for distribution at the booth. Guy will make copies. Stephen also expects to provide IBIS_ML, IBIS Connector Specification, and IBIS Version 3.2 documents for the booth for review (but not for handing out since they are large and also available electronically. Milt is handling the arrangements and National Semiconductor is sponsoring the lunch, free to attendees who sign up. Milt reported that 6 individuals have signed up officially, and Bob expects a further 25 people to sign up based on word of mouth. Stephen reminded everyone to sign up so that Milt can have an accurate headcount. Stephen also noted that Fred Balistreri and Applied Simulation Technology will be providing the LCD projector. Bob reported that we plan the following presentations (titles may change): "JEITA Activity Report", Atsuji Ito, Panasonic "IBIS-ML Futures and Discussion", Stephen Peters, Intel "IBIS-ML Examples", Lynne Green, Cadence "Connector Specification Discussion", Gus Panella, Molex "EMC Presentation", Guy de Burgh, Innoveda "IBIS Accuracy at IBM", Greg Edlund, IBM "IBIS Users Experience", Barry Katz, Signal Integrity Software "IBIS Version 4.0 Report" TBD Stephen also reported that there are three DesignCon2002 presentations that directly relate to IBIS are listed in the catalog for Wednesday, January 30: "A Comparison of IBIS to HSPICE in Simulation of a 2.5 Gbps LVDS Buffer" (Chris Brewster, Siqual; Dave Thomson, Agere Systems) "Assessing and Improving the Quality of IBIS Models" (Kevin fisher, Barry Katz, Steven Ladd, Roberd Moles, Signal Integrity Software; John Figueroa, Apple Computer) "Accurately Modeling LVDS with IBIS" (Adam Tambone, Fairchild Semiconductor) Several other active IBIS people are also presenting at DesignCon 2002. Stephen expects that another announcement will be sent out next week. FUTURE SUMMIT MEETINGS PLANS - Date2002 Bob Ross reported that plans are underway for a European IBIS Summit Meeting on Friday, March 8, 2002 associated with DATE2002 in Paris France. Innoveda, Mentor Graphics and Zuken are co-sponsoring and funding the meeting. Bob reported that an announcement should be sent out in early January 2002 (even before the DesignCon2002 IBIS meeting for presentations and signup. As before, there will probably be a strong emphasis on EMC/EMI issues. IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION Bob Ross reported no recent models have been received. MAJORDOMO UPDATE John Angulo reported that we are going to a closed list. One Spam message has been received that got distributed. Bob Ross noted that because the list is now closed, some folks from Mentor Graphics and Innoveda are no longer able to post to the list. This is because their sending e-mail address is different than their receiving one, thus they are not subscribed to the list. In addition, John noted that the majordomo system does not send any indication to a poster that their e-mail bounced. The majority of active posters seem to have this problem. After discussion it was decided to revert back to the open list again, at least temporarily. John will investigate how to get the majordomo system to return an intelligent 'bounced message' indication to a sender if their e-mail address is not in the subscription list. Bob Ross reported he has not yet investigated a list [IBIS] title and appending the IBIS messages with archive and subscription information. CONNECTOR PROPOSAL REPORT Stephen Peters reported on meetings held November 20 and December 4, 2001. The next meeting will be held on December 11, 2002. Assuming there are no copyright or other issues, the connector committee is planning on incorporating the Touchstone S-parameter format into the specification. The next two meeting will concentrate on an editorial review of section 8 (matrix formats). The committee plans on having a copy of the connector specification available for comment at the upcoming IBIS summit. IBIS FUTURES REPORT Stephen Peters reported on meetings held November 29 and December 6 2001. The next meetings are scheduled for December 13 and December 20. Work continues on defining the macro language (IBIS-ML) and reviewing the implementation of IBIS 3.2 in IBIS-ML. Stephen reported that after reviewing the existing attempt to describe IBIS 3.2 using IBIS-ML that it has become apparent that a lot more work remains. Stephen does not believe that the committee will have a fully fleshed out IBIS-ML 1.0 specification ready in time for the IBIS summit. BIRD73.4 - FALL BACK SUBMODEL Bob Ross issued BIRD73.4 with editorial cleanup and changes based on the comments received at the November 16th, 2001 meeting. Only one table was corrected. However, due to the low quorum and the fact that several technical reviewers have not had a chance to closely review BIRD73.4, Stephen and Bob recommended postponing the vote on this Bird until the January 7th meeting. AR, All -- review the Bird in preparation for a vote at the next meeting. IBISCHK3 & BUG TRACKING STATUS Bob Ross reported that Matthew Flora sent out ibischk3.2.8 to the companies holding the source code license. The executables have been developed by Guy de Burgh (Unix), Matthew Flora (Windows) and Lynne Green (Linux). These have been uploaded under: http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/ibischk3/ (Bob sent out an incorrect link.) BUG48-56 (except previously fixed BUG53) and BUG59 were fixed. The bug list has been updated under: http//www.eda.org/pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/ Thanks to all for helping out on the parser distribution. Atul Agarwal has billed us for his work at $3126, which we had agreed to previously. We want to call for a consensus vote to approve payment from our bank account. Stephen Peters called for vote, and the IBIS committee unanimously approved making the payment. AR - Cecilia Fleming transfer the money to Atul's account per the Invoice. Bob reported that two more BUG reports are planned. We should also start working with Atul to fix the next set of bugs for a Version 3.2.9 release. - BUG64 - Error with Four [Driver Schedule] Entries Arpad Muranyi introduced BUG64. This issue is that the specification specifically allows four delay entries under the [Driver Schedule] keyword, yet when he tried it the parser reported this as an error. Stephen Peters asked if there was a workaround to this problem, and after discussion we determined that there was. Therefore, the severity of this bug is classified as "Moderate" rather than "Severe". BUG64 was classified as MODERATE, HIGH, OPEN and to be fixed. - BUG65 - Change P/NMOS FET Series Element Error to Warning Bob Ross introduced BUG65. This came from Phillips Semiconductor, which is dealing with P/NMOS FET Series Elements. The problem is that if the starting current in the [Series NMOS] table is greater than the ending current then the parser will flag this as an error, thus preventing a legitimate parallel PMOS/NMOS series switch from being modeled. The error should be changed to a warning. Note that accepted BIRD72.3 allows a parallel PMOS/NMOS FET series switch element, but this bug needs to be fixed in the meantime. BUG65 was classified as MODERATE, MEDIUM, OPEN and to be fixed in the next release. S2IBIS2 - BUG2 - CANNOT READ IBIS FILE USING SPITRAN Bob Ross introduced BUG2 against the North Carolina State s2ibis2 parser and related SPITRAN free-ware. After some discussion, we decided that we would not officially support such interaction issues that were documents. BUG2 was classified as ANNOYING, LOW, WILL NOT FIX because we are not supporting SPITRAN. Aprad Muranyi asked if this was a s2ibis2 bug, and if it isn't why was this bug reported as BUG2 under S2IBIS2. Stephen Peters responded that the bug was reported using the S2IBIS2 bug report form, so we simply were trying to disposition the bug. XML FOR IBIS Bob Ross reported that he has received the XML material and the "sanitized" examples from Atul Agarwal. They are now uploaded under: http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/xml/ The user needs to be familiar with XML and related utilities to use the uploaded material for XML to IBIS and IBIS to XML conversions. Atul gave a general disclaimer, "... these illustrate an approach to IBIS/XML modeling and the DTD's are not yet perfect." Atul welcomes feedback. Arpad Muranyi asked what exactly the XML file represents. Bob replied that this was an example IBIS data file (.ibs) file. Bob noted that once an .ibs file has been translated into XML it can be parsed into a data base by an XML parser, no need for the ibis parser. NEXT MEETING: The next teleconference meeting will be on Friday, January 11, 2002 from 8:00 A.M. to 10:00 AM Pacific time. Vote on BIRD73.4. ============================================================================ NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-1831 stephen.peters@intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF4-215 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, OR 97124-5961 VICE CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897 bob_ross@mentor.com Modeling Engineer, Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070 SECRETARY: Guy de Burgh (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 gdeburgh@innoveda.com Senior Manager, Innoveda 1369 Del Norte Rd. Camarillo, CA 93010-8437 LIBRARIAN: Roy Leventhal (837) 797-2152, Fax: (847) 222-2799 roy_leventhal@3com.com Senior Engineer, CommWorks Corp. (a wholly owned 3Com subsidiary) 1800 W. Central Rd. Mt. Prospect, IL 60056-2293 WEBMASTER: Syed Huq (408) 525-3399, Fax: (408) 526-5504 shuq@cisco.com Manager, Hardware Engineering, Cisco Systems 170 West Tasman Drive San Jose, CA 95134-1706 POSTMASTER: John Angulo (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008 jangulo@innoveda.com Development Engineer, Innoveda 14715 N.E. 95th Street, Suite 200 Redmond, WA 98052 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: majordomo@eda.org In the body, for the IBIS Open Forum Reflector: subscribe ibis In the body, for the IBIS Users' Group Reflector: subscribe ibis-users Help and other commands: help ibis-request@eda.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@eda.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@eda.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@eda.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@eda.org To report ibischk2/3 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt, /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, and /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eigroup.org/ibis/ibis.htm Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. ============================================================================