DATE: July 2, 1996
SUBJECT: 6/28/96 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes
VOTING MEMBERS AND 1996 PARTICIPANTS LIST:
AMP Hank Herrmann*, Tim Minnick, Russ Moser
Cadence Design C. Kumar
Contec CAE, Ltd. Dileep Divekar*, Norio Matsui, Antonis Orphanou
Cypress Bruce Wenniger
Hewlett Packard, EEsof Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu
HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli*
INCASES Olaf Rethmeier*, Ralf Bruening
Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Will Hobbs*, Arpad Muranyi*,
John Keifer, Aaron Tang, Duane Quiet,
[Donald Telian], Jim Kruchowski
Interconnectix, Inc. Bob Ross, Chris Reid*
Meta-Software (Sanjay Gangal)
Mitsubushi Tam Cao, Hoang Nguyen
Motorola Ahmed Omer
National Semiconductor Syed Huq*, Donald Snyder, Chune-Sin Yeh,
Bill Aronson
NCR (formerly ATT-GIS) Dave Moxley*, Richard Mellitz
NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto),
Quad Design Jon Powell*, Chris Rokusek*
Texas Instruments Roger Cline, Ben Andresen, Sri Jandhyala,
Tareq Shahwan, Dan Phipps
Thomson-CSF/SCTF (Jean LeBrun)
UniCAD Canada Ltd. Celso Faia*
VLSI Technology Dick Ulmer, Sung Oh, Swami Gangadharan,
Daniel Kim, Tom Dockery, D.C. Sessions
Zuken-Redac (John Berrie)
OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1996:
Alcatel John Fitzpatrick*
Altera Vadim von Brzeski
Apteq Design System Dan FitzPatrick
Compaq Mark Leonard
Digital Equipment Corp. Jeff Chu*
EIA Patti Rusher*
IC Works Eric Chen
Micron Technology Brian Johnson
MicroSim Ralph Perez
Molex Gus Panella
North Carolina State U. (Michael Steer)
Oki Semiconductor Tom Chao
Philips Semiconductor Mike Magdaluyo
Rockwell Collins Thomas Thurman
S3, Inc. Sarathy Sribhashyam, Phap Duong
Seimans Nixdorf Arnaud Lacariere
Symmetry Andy Hughes
Tektronix, Inc. Brock Hannibal
TRW & Free Model Foundation Robert Harrison
Veribest Ian Dodd, David Wiens
VTC, Inc. Bob Ward
Zeelan Technology George Opsahl
In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principle
members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses.
Participants who have joined another organization are in square brackets.
Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as
follows:
Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode
7/19/96 (916) 356-9200 2-78903 6186335
All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out
7 days before each open forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after.
When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will
Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode.
NOTE: "AR" = Action Required.
-------------------------------- MINUTES -------------------------------------
INTRODUCTIONS
Syed Huq chaired the meeting, and Jon Powell served as secretary. (These
minutes are based on Jon's and Will Hobb's notes and other inputs.)
EIA MEMBERSHIP AND TREASURER'S REPORT
Patti Rusher did not have updated figures, but estimates the treasury at
about $6000 to $8000. The treasurer's report was garbled due to a bug
in Patti's program. EIA will issue a new report soon. AMP's invoice
situation has been taken care of for now.
MINUTES REPORT, MISC.
The spelling Peivand Tehrani's last name has been corrected, and the paper
is on page 1009 of the conference proceedings.
The last meetings 9 AM to 1 PM times and Las Vegas, Nevada location have been
added to the minutes.
All previous AR's were handled including issuing BIRD36 and BIRD37 and data
related to multi-staged driver models.
MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS
None.
PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES
Electronic Design, June 10, 1996, page 64, a HyperLynx introduction references
IBIS.
Electrical Engineering Times, June 17, 1996, pg. 86, a Veribest introduction
references IBIS.
Electronic News, June 17, 1996, pg. 46, Symmetry Design Systems announces
IBIS modeling service and future models.
The 1996 National Interface Databook, Chapter 13 on Modeling Support is
devoted entirely to IBIS models and provides "An Introduction to IBIS
Modeling Section" by Syed Huq, and also references many of the participating
IBIS Committee CAE vendors and their tools.
VLSI IBIS models are now available on the Web:
http://www.vlsi.com/vlsi/products/ibis/ibis.html
The EIA/IBIS web page has been enhanced to add tools selection.
Quad Design is adding a page with hot links to all free IBIS models available
throughout industry.
Patti Rusher reports that the IBIS page is the second most popular EIA page.
NEW MODELS
None reported.
OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES
Secretary Position
Series Resistor
INTERNATIONAL STANDARDIZATION
Patti Rusher Indicated that there is a project underway to gain money from
DARPA for modeling programs. The intention is to use the money to fill holes
in the standards efforts, such as funding the Express Model. This is
problematic since the University of Manchester can not receive US grant
money directly. They would have to be sub-contracted through a US company
or university. Some funding options exist and there may be some news in
several weeks.
Will Hobbs and Stephen Peters will give a presentation on modeling standards
at an international conference in Prague in July, 1996.
AR - Stephen Peters and Will Hobbs will discuss the money and time for Express
Representation with Hilary Kahn in Prague at an international standards
conference.
Ron Waxman has introduced IBIS as a work item into the IEC process. So even
without Express, the international standardization process is underway.
SECRETARY
Will Hobbs feels that the lack of a secretary needs resolution. For now
we are sharing the duty from meeting to meeting. No one at the meeting
indicated an interest in taking the post. This must be a person from a
member company since it is an official EIA committee position.
AR - Syed Huq post a request to ibis@vhdl.org requesting volunteers.
EGG11 - ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM VOLTAGE
John Fitzpatrick of Alcatel requested a field be added to the model to specify
the maximum voltage that can be sustained without damage. Semiconductor
suppliers do not generally want to give out this information. The issue is
important for PCI interface components and components with split supplies.
One use for this information would be to have the simulator pop out a warning
if the maximum voltage limits (voltage versus time) is exceeded. This could
be handled on a per-model basis, as an optional parameter or parameters. It
might need to be a table. Jon Powell asked if it was a non-linear table.
John indicated that it could be highly non-linear.
This information could be tabulated like the other IBIS tables. It could also
be a single value. Both positive and negative voltages would be tabulated.
Kellee Chrisafulli pointed out that it may have to be power supply relative,
such as one diode over Vcc.
John plans to accept the comments and convert this into a BIRD.
Several EDA vendors indicated that they would support issuing a message that
indicates that the maximum safe levels have been exceeded.
BIRD36 - ELECTRICAL BOARD DESCRIPTION
Stephen Peters issued BIRD36 for an electrical board description. Hank
Herrmann provided several comments:
(1) Add a NC (No Connect) in the pin list for open sided connectors
(2) Strike the word "mated" (for unmated models)
(3) Change minimum "rise" time to minimum "edge" time.
(4) Set a limit on the total number of externally accessible pins.
(5) Set a 5 character limit for the total number of pins.
(6) Change the maximum number of characters from 5 to 8 under [Pin List]
(7) Under [Path Description] the for node, the subparameter could be a .ibs
model.
The discussion involved whether IBIS would allow an .ebd file to describe a
populated SIMM, for example. There was a long discussion on whether this
should be allowed to be embedded within a .ibs file, or visa-versa (making
the IBIS Specification very complex), or to keep it as a separate file. The
consensus was to keep it separate. The golden parser will still have to check
.ebd files.
It would be desirable to allow a .ebd file to contain a reference to another
.ebd file, to support situations such as SIMMs that plug into SIMMs. Kellee
Chrisafulli suggests we roll the BIRD such that the component can be either a
.ibs or a .ebd file, and solicit further comments.
Kellee was also concerned about the ambiguity of unit length. He feels it
should be explicitly specified to be treated as distributed LRC elements in
the section where the length is specified. Stephen will make this change.
Chris Reid of Interconnectix noted that the pin number section has a potential
problem with matrix creation when there is a mismatch between pin count and
path count. If a 16 pin connector has 32 pins, how do you define the matrix?
You would want a 16 X 16 matrix, not a 32 X 32 matrix. A few more examples
would help.
The specific changes were:
(1) Add a keyword for reference designator mapping (ibs/ebd file and
component).
(2) Highlight that RLC are distributed.
(3) Consider Hank's email comments.
(4) Specify which pins are used in the matrix (or drop the matrix). The
matrix issue needs to be reviewed.
(5) What are the boundaries of the model. Where does one model end and
another begin.
It was suggested that Stephen roll in the suggested changes and issue BIRD36.1
for a possible vote next meeting.
BIRD35.1 - MULTI-STAGED OUTPUTS
Jon Powell described BIRD35.1 as a method for scheduling sequences of output
buffer characteristics. The technical discussion was deferred until Bob Ross,
author of BIRD35.1 can participate at the next meeting. Jon noted the primary
problem with this type of output is that there is no way to create a model via
measurement. Such buffers are usually implemented with internal delay lines
to which measurements have no access. Only the chip manufacturer would have
access to this information.
However, the conclusion was that BIRD35.1 is ready for a vote.
EGG10 - PARSER ADDITIONS FOR NUMERICAL CHECKING
Chris Rokusek stated that EGG10 checks for reasonable values in IBIS files.
Chris has extracted all of the parameters out of an IBIS file and found some
out of range values. The raw data can be analyzed and discussed at the next
meeting. Arpad Muranyi noted that the data format of the files that were sent
out were inaccessible to him. (The data was retransmitted in ASCII form.)
SERIES RESISTOR
Arpad Muranyi suggested that we add support for series devices such as diodes
and resistors to IBIS 3.0. Jon Powell felt this was OK as long as the
component could be specified as a V/I curve.
NEXT MEETING:
The next meeting is on Friday, July 19, 1996, 8:00 A.M. to 10:00 A.M.
==============================================================================
NOTES
IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 603-2523, Fax (503) 639-3469
bob@icx.com
Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix, Inc.
10220 SW Nimbus Ave, K4, Portland, OR 97223
VICE CHAIR: Syed Huq (408) 721-4874, Fax: (408) 721-4785
huq@rockie.nsc.com
Staff Applications Engineer, National Semiconductor, M/S A-2595
2900 Semiconductor Drive, Santa Clara, CA 95052
LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259
jonp@qdt.com
Transmission-Line Products Manager, Quad Design
1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010
SECRETARY: Vacant
This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA
Manual of Organization and Procedure.
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or both. State your request.
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To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions
for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS
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ibis@vhdl.org
To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This
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technical enhancements.
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To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is
used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and
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ibischk-bug@vhdl.org
To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on
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Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual
IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the
Electronic Information Group under:
Check the pub/ibis directory on vhdl.org for more information on previous
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"IBIS Spoken Here" placards are available from Jon Powell (jonp@qdt.com) for
use at trade shows.
==============================================================================
Received on Tue Jul 2 15:55:42 1996
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