Just because a model follows the IBIS standard does not mean it is not
also a companies IP. I'm just saying that you have to be careful.
AR Rafiq wrote:
> Scott,
>
> Doesn't that defeat one of the objective of IBIS?
>
> Regards,
>
> AR
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Apr 6, 2010, at 1:23 PM, scott@teraspeed.com wrote:
>
>> for many models users cannot legally share information such as
>> ibischk scores. The owner of the website would be legally
>> responsible for policing each and every usage agreement. This is why
>> independent companies provide this service.
>>
>> We keep an updated ibis model links page on our website that bob Ross
>> manages
>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: <colin_warwick@agilent.com>
>> Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 14:04:54
>> To: <jon.n.powell@intel.com>; <weirsi@ipblox.com>;
>> <si-list@freelists.org>
>> Cc: <bob@teraspeed.com>; <ibis@eda.org>; <ibis-users@eda.org>
>> Subject: [IBIS] RE: [SI-LIST] Re: Straw poll and call for comments:
>> Crowdsource
>> IBIS model directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia?
>>
>> Hi Jon,
>>
>> Yes, IP and updates are an issue, so the plan is to let IC vendors
>> build a directory of links and/or "how-to-get-the-model"
>> instructions, not the models themselves. Users will add reviews and
>> ratings and IBISCHK scores.
>>
>> -- Colin Warwick
>> Signal Integrity Product Marketing Manager, Agilent EEsof EDA
>> blog http://signal-integrity.tm.agilent.com
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: si-list-bounce@freelists.org
>> [mailto:si-list-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of Powell, Jon N
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 11:48 AM
>> To: steve weir; si-list@freelists.org
>> Cc: bob@teraspeed.com; ibis@eda.org; ibis-users@eda.org
>> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Straw poll and call for comments: Crowdsource
>> IBIS model directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia?
>>
>> Isn't there also a legal issue here?
>> Who owns the IP or the copyright and who is going to be responsible
>> for violation of said when a copy is kept in a database?
>>
>>
>>
>> Jon Powell
>>
>> EPSD Product SI
>>
>> 將
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: si-list-bounce@freelists.org
>> [mailto:si-list-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of steve weir
>> Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 6:58 PM
>> To: si-list@freelists.org
>> Cc: bob@teraspeed.com; ibis@eda.org; ibis-users@eda.org
>> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Straw poll and call for comments: Crowdsource
>> IBIS model directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia?
>>
>> Colin,
>>
>> Hosting is so cheap as to be a non-issue. Setting up the database
>> mechanics is not particularly difficult either.
>> The real cost is in the administration. In my opinion this needs people
>> willing to serve as librarians who will act as the gate keepers so that
>> the site is not overrun with junk.
>>
>> Best Regards,
>>
>>
>> Steve.
>>
>> colin_warwick@agilent.com wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Thanks to everyone for the feedback and encouragement :-)
>>>
>>> There are several options each with pros and cons
>>> * Web page with an appointed honorary librarian
>>> * Wikis e.g. hosted and self-hosted http://www.wikimatrix.org/
>>> * Discussion forums (bulletin boards) e.g. hosted and self-hosted
>>> http://www.forummatrix.org/
>>> * Email reflectors like the si-list http://freelists.org
>>> * Shared document/table like a Google Docs spreadsheet.
>>> http://docs.google.com/
>>> * Hybrids of the above like Google Wave http://wave.google.com which
>>> they say is a "next generation" email/collaboration/documentation tool
>>>
>>> Here are some issues with each:
>>> * Ease-of-use versus functionality: email is easy to use, but email
>>> reflectors and forums have limited searchablity and it's hard to
>>> aggregate threads of (possibility duplicative) conversations.
>>> * WYSIWYG versus markup languages: some wikis and forums require you
>>> learn a mark up language.
>>> * "One truth" (conclusion) versus "Let a hundred flowers blossom"
>>> (conversation) (yes, I do understand the irony of Mao Zedong's
>>> imperative):
>>> ** Wikis attempt to arrive at some sort of consensus between the
>>> editors on the readers' behalf (although there's usually a
>>> discussion page for editors behind the "real" page for readers)
>>> whereas
>>> ** Discussion Forums let everyone voice their own opinion and each
>>> reader has to plow through the threads to draw their own conclusion
>>> from the (possibly heated) conversation.
>>> * Reputation: How do you hold a contributor accountable for their
>>> contribution? How exclude spam in?
>>> * Privacy: How much info to do I have to submit to sign up? As a
>>> reader? As a writer? How to prevent harvesting of personal info by
>>> nefarious agents?
>>> * History/reversion: How do we track and undo "bad" edits? How to
>>> delete "bad" postings?
>>> * Who pays? There are plenty of "free" hosting sites, usually
>>> ad-funded. Do we want an ad free site by paying to self-hosting fee?
>>> If so, how do we split the check?
>>> * Structured versus unstructured: Do you want a rigorous database
>>> schema (specific column headings/fields for each row/record in
>>> (possibly interlinked) tables)? Or more free form? If structured,
>>> how to come to a consensus schema?
>>> * Who runs the thing? What are the costs and benefits for the admin?
>>>
>>> I added a second straw poll to the bottom of:
>>>
>>> http://signal-integrity.tm.agilent.com/2010/crowdsource-ibis-models-directory/
>>>
>>>
>>> ...so you can vote for your favorite...
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> -- Colin Warwick
>>> Signal Integrity Product Manager, Agilent EEsof EDA
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: si-list-bounce@freelists.org
>>> [mailto:si-list-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of Howard Johnson
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2010 1:00 AM
>>> To: si-list@freelists.org
>>> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Straw poll and call for comments: Crowdsource
>>> IBIS model directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia?
>>>
>>> Hey Colin,
>>>
>>> I think you are on to a good idea. Individual users spend way too
>>> much time
>>> farting around trying to put together good IBIS models. Much of that
>>> effort
>>> seems wasted.
>>>
>>> I'd like to see the list include some sort of "user voting" feature
>>> so the
>>> readers of the list could see if other people found the model "useful".
>>> Some "wiki" type tools allow that kind of feedback and I believe it
>>> would be
>>> crucial, because I believe you will never get an official committee
>>> to vet
>>> the models -- it has to be done through independent user evaluations.
>>>
>>> Good luck, and keep plugging on this idea, it's a good one.
>>>
>>> Yes, I went to your link and voted.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Dr. Howard Johnson, Signal Consulting Inc.,
>>> tel +1 509-997-0505, howie03@sigcon.com
>>> www.sigcon.com -- High-Speed Digital Design seminars, publications
>>> and films
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: si-list-bounce@freelists.org
>>> [mailto:si-list-bounce@freelists.org] On
>>> Behalf Of steve weir
>>> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 6:09 PM
>>> To: colin_warwick@agilent.com
>>> Cc: si-list@freelists.org
>>> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Straw poll and call for comments: Crowdsource
>>> IBIS
>>> model directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia?
>>>
>>> My view on the usefulness of such a directory all depends on how
>>> well the
>>> directory would be maintained / policed and whether the directory would
>>> include information that would indicate the model's likely usefulness.
>>> There are a lot of IBIS ( HSPICE models as well for that matter ), that
>>> aren't particularly useful. Many have not been verified in any
>>> way. Some
>>> of them do not even parse.
>>>
>>> Anyway, if this is going to be undertaken, I would really like to see
>>> something similar to the way that the FPGA vendors list IP cores.
>>>
>>> Target Model Manufacturer
>>> Target Model Part Number
>>> Free or pay model
>>> Model basis: Raw original model, SPICE derived model, Measurement
>>> based
>>> model IBIS version Passed parser or not w/ parser version Model
>>> verified or
>>> not Link to model, or model supplier
>>>
>>> Steve
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> colin_warwick@agilent.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> Bottom line on top: Any interest in using and/or contributing to an
>>>> IBIS
>>>>
>>> model directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia? Please vote in this
>>> informal straw poll:
>>>
>>>>
>>> http://signal-integrity.tm.agilent.com/2010/crowdsource-ibis-models-director
>>>
>>> y/
>>>
>>>> ...and/or leave a comment there, and/or comment to this thread.
>>>>
>>>> Backstory: I posted the message below to the IBIS lists, but was
>>>> disappointed that the response was fairly mute. So, I'm posting it
>>>> here in the hope it will resonate with si-listers. (If you are also on
>>>> the IBIS lists, this is a duplicate. Sorry!)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>>
>>>> -- Colin Warwick
>>>> Signal Integrity Product Manager, Agilent EEsof EDA
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: WARWICK,COLIN
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 11:59 AM
>>>> To: IBIS-Interconnect; 'ibis-macro@freelists.org'
>>>> Subject: Straw poll and call for comments: Crowdsource IBIS model
>>>>
>>> directory by use of a wiki such as wikipedia?
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> I get several emails a month from customers asking "Is there an
>>>> IBIS model
>>>>
>>> for XYZ part from ABC IC vendor". I usually point them at:
>>>
>>>> http://www.teraspeed.com/ibis_resources.html
>>>> http://www.eigroup.org/ibis/ibis%20table/models.htm
>>>>
>>>> If the info is out-of-date (as is often the case), I ask them to do an
>>>> advanced Google search like:
>>>> http://www.google.com/advanced_search?q=IBIS+site:someicvendordomain.c
>>>> om
>>>>
>>>> (replace someicvendordomain.com with the IC vendor's domain,
>>>> obviously)
>>>>
>>>> But I'm wondering if there's a better way than "spray and pray"
>>>> Googling
>>>>
>>> or burdening a single librarian with hundreds of update requests.
>>>
>>>> Sooo...How about crowdsourcing?
>>>>
>>>> "Crowd-what-ing," you say? Here's a definition from wikipedia:
>>>>
>>>> 'Crowdsourcing is a neologistic compound of Crowd and Outsourcing
>>>> for the
>>>>
>>> act of taking tasks traditionally performed by an employee or
>>> contractor,
>>> and outsourcing them to a group of people or community, through an
>>> "open
>>> call" to a large group of people (a crowd) asking for contributions.'
>>>
>>>> (from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowdsourcing )
>>>>
>>>> Specifically, I'm wondering if we should create a table off of the
>>>> main
>>>>
>>> IBIS page on wikipedia:
>>>
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Input_Output_Buffer_Information_Specifica
>>>> tion
>>>>
>>>> ...(or some other wiki) for IC vendors to update their info
>>>> themselves. It
>>>>
>>> would look something like this prototype I cobbled together:
>>>
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Woz2/Input_Output_Buffer_Information
>>>> _Specification/Table_of_IBIS_models
>>>>
>>>> Thoughts? Please vote in this informal straw poll:
>>>>
>>>> http://signal-integrity.tm.agilent.com/2010/crowdsource-ibis-models-di
>>>> rectory/
>>>>
>>>> and/or leave a comment there, and/or comment to this thread.
>>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>>
>>>> -- Colin Warwick
>>>> Signal Integrity Product Manager, Agilent EEsof EDA
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Steve Weir
>> IPBLOX, LLC
>> 150 N. Center St. #211
>> Reno, NV 89501
>> www.ipblox.com
>>
>> (775) 299-4236 Business
>> (866) 675-4630 Toll-free
>> (707) 780-1951 Fax
>>
>>
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>
-- Scott McMorrow Teraspeed Consulting Group LLC 121 North River Drive Narragansett, RI 02882 (401) 284-1827 Business (401) 284-1840 Fax http://www.teraspeed.com Teraspeed® is the registered service mark of Teraspeed Consulting Group LLC -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. -------------------------------------------------------------------- |For help or to subscribe/unsubscribe, e-mail majordomo@eda-stds.org |with the appropriate command message(s) in the body: | | help | subscribe ibis <optional e-mail address, if different> | subscribe ibis-users <optional e-mail address, if different> | unsubscribe ibis <optional e-mail address, if different> | unsubscribe ibis-users <optional e-mail address, if different> | |or e-mail a request to ibis-request@eda-stds.org. | |IBIS reflector archives exist under: | | http://www.eda-stds.org/pub/ibis/email_archive/ Recent | http://www.eda-stds.org/pub/ibis/users_archive/ Recent | http://www.eda-stds.org/pub/ibis/email/ E-mail since 1993Received on Tue Apr 6 14:46:39 2010
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