[IBIS] RE: [ibis-macro] IBIS-ISS Package Modeling Next Steps

Walter,

I would like to comment on your presentation given today in
the ATM teleconference. I have lots of comments, and I think
writing them up in just one email would be too confusing, so
I will probably write several emails on this topic.

Continuing the discussion we had at the end of the meeting,
I am still not sure I understand the reason we need special
purpose syntax in the specification for specific circumstances,
such as "victim model" or "NEXT/FEXT".

I understand that, for example, in the "victim model" only the
victim channel is useful for real analysis and the other paths
are only there to provide coupling/noise on the victim, but I
don't think this is a good reason to have a different syntax to
instantiate and/or connect these types of models.

Also, in our discussion this was contrasted with the "interface
model" which is supposedly useful for real analysis on all of
its channels. I would question whether this statement is actually
true. An interface model is still only a quadrant or slice of
the full model, and as such it is still missing coupling at its
boundaries, which makes the channels near the boundaries only as
good as the aggressor channels of the "victim model". In other
words, I don't see any difference between the victim model and
the interface model, other than the latter might be larger than
the former.

For this reason, I don't think that adding the special purpose
"victim model" syntax to the specification would make the
specification more useful. We might consider adding some
parameters to indicate which of the channels/paths/ports/terminals,
etc... of a given slice model is useful for what purpose, but that's
as far as I would go.

This should be enough for this email. More to come later...

Thanks,

Arpad
====================================================================

From: ibis-macro-bounce@freelists.org [mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of Walter Katz
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2012 6:40 PM
To: IBIS-ATM
Subject: [ibis-macro] IBIS-ISS Package Modeling Next Steps

All,

At the next IBIS-ATM I would like to answer any questions about the presentation I gave today. Posted at:

http://tinyurl.com/cvykehz

or the full URL:

http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/macromodel_wip/archive/20120806/walterkatz/IBIS-ISS%20Package%20Modeling/IBIS_ISS_Package_Modeling_120807.pdf

If you do have any questions, please either e-mail to this reflector or me directly.

More importantly, questions to the IC Vendor members:

1. Does the functionality described in this presentation satisfy your needs to generate package and on-die models using that your customers require?

2. If not, what additional functionality do you need?

3. Please e-mail answers to question 2 to this reflector or me directly in advance of the next IBIS-ATM meeting.

Finally, we need to decide whether to pursue this methodology, or use the methodology describes in BIRDs 125 and 145:

http://www.vhdl.org/pub/ibis/macromodel_wip/archive/20120724/arpadmuranyi/Package%20Modeling%20in%20IBIS/PackageModeling_with_BIRD125_145.pdf

Make IBIS-ISS Available for IBIS Package Modeling<http://www.eda.org/ibis/birds/bird125.1.txt>

Cascading IBIS I/O buffers with [External Circuit]s using the [Model Call] keyword<http://www.eda.org/ibis/birds/bird145.2.txt>

Walter

Walter Katz
wkatz@sisoft.com<mailto:wkatz@sisoft.com>
Phone 303.449-2308
Mobile 303.335-6156

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