From owner-ibis Fri Jan 5 17:30:13 2001 Received: from thalia.fm.intel.com (thalia.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.11]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f061UBj28829; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:30:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from SMTP (fmsmsxvs05-1.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.205]) by thalia.fm.intel.com (8.9.1a+p1/8.9.1/d: relay.m4,v 1.33 2000/11/21 19:27:27 smothers Exp $) with SMTP id BAA06808; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 01:27:56 GMT Received: from fmsmsx28.fm.intel.com ([132.233.48.28]) by 132.233.48.205 (Norton AntiVirus for Internet Email Gateways 1.0) ; Sat, 06 Jan 2001 01:26:33 0000 (GMT) Received: by fmsmsx28.fm.intel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:26:32 -0800 Message-ID: From: "Mirmak, Michael" To: "'ibis@vhdl.org'" Cc: "'ibischk-bug@vhdl.org'" Subject: Problems noted with posted v3.2.6 parser -- requires BUG filing? Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:26:30 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" The most recent edition of the parser (v.3.2.6, DOS32) seems to have a problem with models which lack a [Pullup] keyword. It flags models which have a Model_type of I/O_open_drain, which would not require [Pullup]. I've enclosed an IBIS model below to demonstrate the warning. Is this warning intentional? Should this problem be filed as BUG53? Thanks! - Michael Mirmak, Intel Corp. |*********************************************************************** | [IBIS Ver] 3.2 [File Name] bug53.ibs [File Rev] 0.0 [Date] 05-January-2001 [Source] File created from specification [Notes] Using the IBISCHK3 v3.2.6 parser, the following file will generate a single warning regarding the lack of a [Pullup] section. This warning does not appear in the v.3.2.5 parser's output. | [Disclaimer] (C) Copyright 2001 Intel Corp. All rights reserved This model is for demonstration purposes only, | [Component] GENERIC_IBIS [Manufacturer] Intel Corp. | [Package] | typ min max R_pkg 6.0mO 5.0mO 7.0mO L_pkg 5.0nH 2.0nH 8.0nH C_pkg 1.0pF 0.5pF 1.5pF | | [Pin] signal_name model_name R_pin L_pin C_pin 1 TestSignal1 TestModel1 | |************************************************************************ | [Model] TestModel1 Model_type I/O_open_drain Polarity Non-Inverting Vinl = 800mV Vinh = 2.0V | Cref = 10.0pF Vref = 0.0 Vmeas = 0.4 C_comp 5.00pF 4.00pF 6.00pF | | [Temperature Range] 27.00 100.00 0.00 [Voltage Range] 5.0V 4.75V 5.25V | [Pulldown] | voltage I(typ) I(min) I(max) | -5.0000 -40.0m -34.00m -45.00m -4.0000 -39.0m -33.00m -43.00m 0.0000 0.0m 0.00m 0.00m 5.0000 40.0m 34.0m 45.00m 10.0000 45.0m 40.0m 49.00m | | [GND Clamp] | voltage I(typ) I(min) I(max) | -5.0000 -3900.0mA -3800.00mA -4000.00m -0.7000 -80.0m -75.00m -85.00m -0.6000 -22.0m -20.00m -25.00m -0.5000 -2.4m -2.00m -2.90m -0.4000 0.0A 0.0A 0.00A 5.0000 0.0A 0.0A 0.00A | [Power Clamp] | voltage I(typ) I(min) I(max) | -5.0000 4450.00m NA NA -0.7000 95.0m NA NA -0.6000 23.0m NA NA -0.5000 2.4m NA NA -0.4000 0.0m NA NA 0.0000 0.0m NA NA | [Ramp] |variable typ min max dV/dt_r 2.20/1.06n 1.92/1.28n 2.49/650p dV/dt_f 2.46/1.21n 2.21/1.54n 2.70/770p R_load = 300ohms | | |************************************************************************ [End] | | The new v3.2.6 parser gives the following spurious output: | |IBISCHK3 V3.2.6 | |Checking bug53.ibs for IBIS 3.2 Compatibility... | |WARNING - [Model] TestModel1 has no description of the buffer's high state | DC drive characteristics (no [Pullup] table). This warning | can be silenced by changing the Model_type or by adding a | [Pullup] table. | |Errors : 0 |Warnings: 1 | |File Passed | | | From owner-ibis Fri Jan 5 18:31:11 2001 Received: from relay1.wv.mentorg.com (relay1.mentorg.com [192.94.38.42]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f062V9j28943; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 18:31:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com by relay1.wv.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id SAA26468; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 18:27:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from mentor.com (bob.wv.mentorg.com [147.34.83.63]) by svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id CDTAQK10; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 18:27:27 -0800 Sender: bobr@relay1.mentorg.com Message-ID: <3A56828E.12081CCF@mentor.com> Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 18:27:26 -0800 From: Bob Ross X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ibis@eda.org, ibis-users@eda.org Subject: New IBIS ibischk3 Executables Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To All: New ibischk3 executables designate Version 3.2.6 have been uploaded in the ibischk3 link from the EIA IBIS home page Free Tools site. These executables are available at http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/ibischk3/ Thanks to Guy de Burgh and Matthew Flora for generating them. The Linux executable should be available shortly. The older Version 3.2.5 executables are archived under the same directory. Bob Ross Mentor Graphics From owner-ibis Mon Jan 8 16:02:22 2001 Received: from relay1.wv.mentorg.com (relay1.mentorg.com [192.94.38.42]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0902Kj08494; Mon, 8 Jan 2001 16:02:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com by relay1.wv.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id PAA29460; Mon, 8 Jan 2001 15:58:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from mentor.com (bob.wv.mentorg.com [147.34.83.63]) by svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id CDTARGAX; Mon, 8 Jan 2001 15:58:33 -0800 Sender: bobr@relay1.mentorg.com Message-ID: <3A5A5428.F11E9074@mentor.com> Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 15:58:32 -0800 From: Bob Ross X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Mirmak, Michael" CC: "'ibis@vhdl.org'" , "'ibischk-bug@vhdl.org'" Subject: Re: Problems noted with posted v3.2.6 parser -- requires BUG filing? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Michael: It appears that BUG34 may have been implemented incorrectly. Thank you for reporting this. This will be filed as BUG53. As we check ibischk3.2.6, we might issue ibischk3.2.7 to correct any problems found. Bob Ross Mentor Graphics "Mirmak, Michael" wrote: > > The most recent edition of the parser (v.3.2.6, DOS32) seems to have a > problem > with models which lack a [Pullup] keyword. It flags models which > have a Model_type of I/O_open_drain, which would not require [Pullup]. > > I've enclosed an IBIS model below to demonstrate the warning. Is this > warning intentional? Should this problem be filed as BUG53? > > Thanks! > > - Michael Mirmak, Intel Corp. > > |*********************************************************************** > | > [IBIS Ver] 3.2 > [File Name] bug53.ibs > [File Rev] 0.0 > [Date] 05-January-2001 > [Source] File created from specification > [Notes] Using the IBISCHK3 v3.2.6 parser, the following file > will generate a single warning regarding the lack of > a [Pullup] section. This warning does not appear in > the v.3.2.5 parser's output. > | > [Disclaimer] > (C) Copyright 2001 Intel Corp. > All rights reserved > This model is for demonstration purposes only, > | > [Component] GENERIC_IBIS > [Manufacturer] Intel Corp. > | > [Package] > | typ min max > R_pkg 6.0mO 5.0mO 7.0mO > L_pkg 5.0nH 2.0nH 8.0nH > C_pkg 1.0pF 0.5pF 1.5pF > | > | > [Pin] signal_name model_name R_pin L_pin C_pin > 1 TestSignal1 TestModel1 > | > |************************************************************************ > | > [Model] TestModel1 > Model_type I/O_open_drain > Polarity Non-Inverting > Vinl = 800mV > Vinh = 2.0V > | > Cref = 10.0pF > Vref = 0.0 > Vmeas = 0.4 > C_comp 5.00pF 4.00pF 6.00pF > | > | > [Temperature Range] 27.00 100.00 0.00 > [Voltage Range] 5.0V 4.75V 5.25V > | > [Pulldown] > | voltage I(typ) I(min) I(max) > | > -5.0000 -40.0m -34.00m -45.00m > -4.0000 -39.0m -33.00m -43.00m > 0.0000 0.0m 0.00m 0.00m > 5.0000 40.0m 34.0m 45.00m > 10.0000 45.0m 40.0m 49.00m > | > | > [GND Clamp] > | voltage I(typ) I(min) I(max) > | > -5.0000 -3900.0mA -3800.00mA -4000.00m > -0.7000 -80.0m -75.00m -85.00m > -0.6000 -22.0m -20.00m -25.00m > -0.5000 -2.4m -2.00m -2.90m > -0.4000 0.0A 0.0A 0.00A > 5.0000 0.0A 0.0A 0.00A > | > [Power Clamp] > | voltage I(typ) I(min) I(max) > | > -5.0000 4450.00m NA NA > -0.7000 95.0m NA NA > -0.6000 23.0m NA NA > -0.5000 2.4m NA NA > -0.4000 0.0m NA NA > 0.0000 0.0m NA NA > | > [Ramp] > |variable typ min max > dV/dt_r 2.20/1.06n 1.92/1.28n 2.49/650p > dV/dt_f 2.46/1.21n 2.21/1.54n 2.70/770p > R_load = 300ohms > | > | > |************************************************************************ > [End] > | > | The new v3.2.6 parser gives the following spurious output: > | > |IBISCHK3 V3.2.6 > | > |Checking bug53.ibs for IBIS 3.2 Compatibility... > | > |WARNING - [Model] TestModel1 has no description of the buffer's high state > | DC drive characteristics (no [Pullup] table). This warning > | can be silenced by changing the Model_type or by adding a > | [Pullup] table. > | > |Errors : 0 > |Warnings: 1 > | > |File Passed > | > | > | From owner-ibis Tue Jan 9 13:04:49 2001 Received: from intermailhost.viewlogic.com (intermailhost.viewlogic.com [139.181.6.17]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f09L4jj14183 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 13:04:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.viewlogic.com (mailhost.viewlogic.com [139.181.3.35]) by intermailhost.viewlogic.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA22053 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 16:00:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from taurus.camarillo.innoveda.com (taurus.camarillo.innoveda.com [139.181.194.20]) by mailhost.viewlogic.com (8.8.6/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA24520 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 16:00:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from f22.innoveda.com (f22.camarillo.innoveda.com [139.181.194.48]) by taurus.camarillo.innoveda.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA22115 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 13:00:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by f22.innoveda.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA03609; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 13:00:54 -0800 Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 13:00:54 -0800 From: guy@camarillo.innoveda.com (Guy de Burgh) Message-Id: <200101092100.NAA03609@f22.innoveda.com> To: ibis@eda.org Subject: EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes Date: 1/9/01 SUBJECT: 1/5/01 EIA IBIS Open Forum Meeting Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 2001 PARTICIPANTS LIST: 3Com (& CommWorks) Roy Leventhal* Agilent (Mark Chang) Ansoft Corporation (Eric Bracken) Applied Simulation Technology (Raj Raghuram) Avanti (Chen Hongyu) Brocade Communications (Robert Badal) Cadence Design Ian Dodd* Cisco Systems (Syed Huq) Compaq (Peter LaFlamme) Cypress (Rajesh Manapat) EMC Corporation (Fabrizio Zanella) Fairchild Semiconductor (Craig Klem) IBM Michael Cohen*, Greg Edlund* Innoveda (& HyperLynx) Guy de Burgh*, John Angulo* Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Arpad Muranyi*, Dave Lorang*, Michael Mirmak* LSI Logic Larry Barnes* Mentor Graphics Bob Ross* Micron Technology Randy Wolff*, Yong Phan* Mitsubishi (Tam (Tom) Cao) Molex Incorporated (Gus Panella) Motorola (Ron Werner) National Semiconductor Milt Schwartz* Nortel Networks Calvin Trowell* North East Systems Associates (Edward Sayre) Philips Semiconductor (D.C. Sessions) Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Robinson-Nugent, Inc. (Alexander Barr) Siemens AG (Gerald Bannert) SiQual (Scott McMorrow) Texas Instruments (Thomas Fisher) Time Domain Analysis Systems (Dima Smolyansky Tyco Electronics (Russell Moser) Via Technologies (Weber Chuang) Zuken (& Incases) (Werner Rissiek) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 2001: EIA Cecilia Fleming* Foundary Networks Bertram Chan* Independent, Consultant Al Davis* In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode January 29, 2001 - IBIS Summit Meeting, No Teleconference All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM Bertram Chan joined from Foundary Networks. Bertram described doing EMC and SI and timing analysis in recent designs. His interest in IBIS is in the quality of vendor supplied IBIS models. Bob Ross commented that this will be a topic at the next IBIS Summit Meeting. MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Cecilia Fleming reported that she has received about 15 payments so far for the 33 invoices issued in December 2000 for 2001 membership. Many payments are telephoned in and made by credit card. The telephone number is on the invoice. Bob Ross stated that it is often administratively more efficient in many organizations. Bob is still seeking a representative for one company. He also noted that HyperLynx is now combined with Innoveda in the IBIS Participants list. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S The December 8, 2000 IBIS Minutes were approved without change. The AR's will be discussed during the meeting. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS Bob Ross stated that the December 8, 2000 uploaded Minutes document the IBIS meeting participation for 2000. The new list is started with these Minutes for 2001. All member companies are retained, but non-member companies are dropped. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Bob Ross reported that Greg Edlund sent out the announcements of C code and of Accuracy Report under http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/accuracy/ NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE Bob Ross reported that some IBIS models exist from Fairchild Semiconductor for the EnSigna(TM) products at: http://www.fairchildsemi.com/designcenter/labs/ensigna/resources/models.html OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES Bob Ross - Add [IBIS List] to ibis email. INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS - IEC 62014-1 (IBIS Version 3.2) - Cecilia Fleming stated that she requested status information from IEC TC 93 Secretariat, Greg Ledenbach, but has not yet received a response. - pr EIAJ ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits (IMIC) - No report. - IEC PWI 93-1 Models of Integrated Circuits for EMI Behavioral Simulation (formerly designated as IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation) - Bob Ross expects Jean-Claude Perrin to give more information at the European IBIS Summit Meeting in Munich, Germany on March 16, 2001. - JEDEC JC-16 - Modeling and Testing - Bob Ross had no report from the JEDEC JC-16 and JC-42 meetings in December 2000. Cecilia Fleming stated that the JEDEC minutes are still being prepared. She will send Bob a copy when they are available. IBIS LIBRARIAN Bob Ross restated from the last meeting that Mike LaBonte has resigned the IBIS Librarian position as a result of accepting a new job at a start-up company. Bob called for nominations for the new position. Bob nominated Michael Cohen, but he declined based on job responsibility issues. Bob then nominated Roy Leventhal. With no further nominations, Bob called for a vote. Roy was unanimously elected to the IBIS Librarian position. Roy stated that his group is currently being formed as CommWorks Corporation, a wholly owned subsidiary of 3Com. Roy's address is at the end of the Minutes. DESIGNCON 2001 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING Bob Ross stated again the basic information that the next IBIS Summit Meeting is planned on January 29, 2001 in Santa Clara, California along with DesignCon 2001 (January 29 - February 1, 2001). National Semiconductor is a co-sponsor of this meeting and will provide the lunch. Milt Schwartz is planning for 50 lunches. DesignCon is the other co-sponsor as a result of IBIS Associate Sponsorship of DesignCon 2001. Bob mentioned that we have a passive Booth #861. It is free from DesignCon as part of our co-sponsorship. In the past we have had some electronic demonstrations related to the Accuracy and Connector activities. Innoveda is providing the booth and backdrop. Guy de Burgh requested IBIS member companies to review existing company logos or to provide new logos with Velcro backing for a visual backdrop. The booth will be primarily a meeting place for interaction. Bob will bring some EIA literature. Bob provided some tentative additions to the program (the titles may change): "LVDS Modeling", Hazem Hegany and Mohammed Korany, Mentor Graphics "Modeling Approach for Pre-emphasis Buffers", Hazem Hegany and Mohammed Korany, Mentor Graphics "The Joy of Downloaded Models" Tom Dagostino, Mentor Graphics The existing program so far includes: "Spice 2 IBIS Accuracy Report", Scott McMorrow, Siqual "Connector Specification Discussion", Gus Panella, Molex "IBIS Futures", Stephen Peters, Intel "SCSI-3 Compensation Modeling" Larry Barnes, LSI Logic. Roy Leventhal will not be able to attend, so his presentation is removed: "Modeling Semiconductor Components from 30,000 Feet", Roy Leventhal, 3Com Bob expected another IBIS-Futures presentation to be determined at the next Working Group Meeting, probably by Al Davis: "IBIS-X Prototype", Al Davis, Consultant Bob stated that we will have enough presentations and discussion items for a full day meeting. Bob may have an introductory presentation. As before, interactive discussion and even Ad-Hoc presentations will be encouraged. Milt Schwartz reported about 10 new signups as a result of the last announcement sent in late December 2000. Bob estimates over 20 people so far, including several that indicated they were attending at this meeting. So we are on target for the usual 30 to 50 attendees. Bob will work with Milt to add the program topics to the next announcement planned for next week. A final announcement should follow later to get a more accurate estimate for participation and lunch (Milt has reserved room for 50). DATE 2001 EUROPEAN IBIS SUMMIT MEETING Bob Ross stated for the Minutes that the early plans for the European IBIS Summit meeting to be held Friday, March 16, 2000 in Munich, Germany along with the Design Automation and Testing in Europe (DATE 2001) conference and exhibit. The IBIS Summit Meeting is on the day after the tradeshow portion of the show. Bob indicated that four companies are now planning to co-sponsor the meeting: Cadence, Innoveda, Mentor Graphics and Zuken (Incases). Bob plans to work with the co-sponsors on the final commitments, details, time of meeting, etc. IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION John Angulo stated that he received a model but returned it for further works since it failed ibischk3. ADD [IBIS-List] TO IBIS E-MAIL (New Agenda Item) Bob Ross stated that a request was made regarding adding to tag such as [IBIS-List] to the subject line of IBIS reflector mail. This is similar to the SI list [SI-List] tag. Bob asked John Angulo to look into this. We are now using an older manual mail system, but might transition to Majordomo. John agreed to look into this. CONNECTOR PROPOSAL REVIEW Ian Dodd stated that the planned meeting between he and Gus Panella did not occur on December 12, 2000. After some discussion with Bob Ross, the next Working Group meeting will be planned on January 16, 2001. Roy Leventhal asked, and Bob responded that we were quite far along on the Connector Specification. Ian stated that his main concern was to complete the new formal language for naming pins in the Specification. IBIS FUTURES (IBIS-X, API, BIRDxx) Stephen Peters reported on the IBIS Futures meeting held on December 19, 2000. The current activity centers on writing the Header document for the IBIS-X specification. The macro-language for buffers needs to be formally documented based on Al Davis' work. Stephen presented the current issues: (1) aligning the Connector Specification header with the proposed IBIS-X header (this may involve having the same [Begin .. ] [End ..] syntax, and (2) including a die interconnect section (this was one motivation for IBIS-X). Al has released a partially working prototype to the Working Group. It is not ready for public release, but interested people can contact Al directly at aldavis@ieee.org for a copy. Stephen expects to deliver a high level overview of IBIS-X at the IBIS Summit meeting. Al will probably discuss the prototype. This will be discussed at the next Working Group meeting scheduled on January 9, 2001. BIRD65.1 - C_comp REFINEMENTS Bob Ross stated that we have already approved four BIRDs in a planned IBIS Version 4.0 release. A work in progress draft version of IBIS Version 4.0 with these four BIRDs exists in the following directory: http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/wip/ Bob introduced BIRD65.1 noting that Arpad Muranyi, the author, changed the proposed sub-parameter names to C_comp_pullup, C_comp_pulldown, C_comp_power and C_comp_ground to be consistent with other keywords and sub-parameters. Bob commented that he would like C_comp_ground to be changed to C_comp_gnd to be even more consistent. Arpad agreed to do this. Bob also noted that Al Davis documented several concerns in and IBIS reflector e-mail. Arpad gave a brief overview of BIRD65.1 indicating that there was a need to split C_comp into four components for better return path analysis. Bob then asked Al to discuss his concerns and Arpad to respond. Al asked how the C_comp components were extracted. Arpad responded that he has been able to do this from Spice files using his extraction utility. Al asked Arpad to post this information. Al stated that vendors often have difficulty allocating DC currents when forming the various I-V tables. He felt that splitting C_comp would be equally difficult. Arpad responded that if the right techniques are followed, the allocation of C_comp can be done correctly (for the purposes of modeling). Roy Leventhal wanted clarification from a higher level on why we should do this. Arpad responded that simulations for return path and resonances need this added detail. Bob asked, and Arpad responded that he has successfully prototyped this decomposition and got improved simulation results. There was some more discussion about modeling level of abstraction and also whether this level of detail created intellectual property issues. Based on Al's comments and discussion, we needed to clarify whether BIRD65.1 intended four or five power nodes. Al stated that BIRD65.1 might be interpreted to mean if C_comp is provided, it is attached to an ideal ground (node "0") reference. Arpad indicated that he intended to have four power nodes. Bob and Al stated that this needs to be clarified. Al commented that IBIS-X could handle even more general C_comp descriptions and decompositions including voltage dependencies. Bob also commented that the TTpower and TTgnd based C value was actually a voltage dependent capacitor. The decomposed C_comp terms were different and assumed to be constant effective capacitances for the purposes of modeling. Bob suggested deferring the vote so that BIRD65.2 could be issued and people absorb some of the discussion. More responses and discussion will be done on the IBIS reflector. So BIRD65.2 will be scheduled for a vote at the next IBIS teleconference meeting. BIRD68 - CLARIFY THAT RISING AND FALLING WAVEFORM TABLES SHOULD BE CORRELATED Bob Ross introduced BIRD68 by noting that it had been discussed previously. It clarified further that the [Rising Waveform] and [Falling Waveform] tables should be time correlated with each other to a common time reference point. Equal lead-in delay could optionally be removed form both edges. The primary reason for BIRD68 was for correct intersymbol interference analysis. However, in prior meetings, we noted that differential models, driver schedule models and submodels all could have a similar implied restriction. Dave Lorang, author of BIRD68, concurred. Bob noted that one issue was whether to document time correlation explicitly by some sub-parameter or follow BIRD68 and just add this requirement as a clarifying statement. Al Davis favored adding just a clarifying statement since it really is a necessary assumption. Bob agreed, even though he knew of some possible measurement extraction concerns. As previously mentioned, Bob also was concerned with the specific language "input stimulus is assumed to have initiated at the logic transition". This could be interpreted as the time of actually triggering the transition - an undefined or hard to determine value. A better statement might refer to a common input stimulus reference time, such as the beginning of the input stimulus waveform for each edge. While there might be some slight error because of input signal amplitude or ramp rate, this approach would still be more consistent with actual waveform extraction based on simulation or measurement. AR - Bob Ross will work with Dave Lorang regarding the wording, leading possibly for BIRD68.1 Bob stated that BIRD68.1 will be scheduled for a vote at the next teleconference meeting. BIRD69 - GOLDEN WAVEFORMS Greg Edlund briefly introduced BIRD69. Greg stated that the IBIS Cookbook, Section 3.2.2, introduced using V-T tables as Golden Waveforms for accuracy comparison. This concept was expanded by the IBIS East Accuracy group that eventually produced the IBIS Accuracy Report. BIRD69 provides the syntax to set up the test circuits (as suggested by Jerry Hayes) and document a corresponding set of "golden waveforms". This is done under two new keywords: [Rising Golden Waveform] and [Falling Golden Waveform]. EDA tools could ignore these additional waveforms or could do accuracy testing by setting up the test circuit simulation and comparing the simulation results with the stored waveforms. Since we were approaching the end of the meeting, Bob Ross planned more discussion on BIRD69 at the next teleconference meeting. IBISCHK3 BUG TRACKING Bob Ross reported that Atul Agarawal delivered the ibischk3.2.6 source code and it was distributed to the companies holding the parser license on January 2, 2001. New executables for ibischk3 have been generated by Guy de Burgh for various Unix operating systems and Matthew Flora for Windows. Syed Huq is expected to generate a Linux executable soon. The executables are uploaded at: http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/ibischk3/ The older Version 3.2.5 executables are also archived under this directory. Bob noted that the new ibischk3 includes fixes for all bugs through BUG47. The fixes still need to be checked. - BUG49 - Warning Message for Unreferenced Models, Submodels Bob stated that we ran out of time before reaching this topic. All that remained was to decide on how we wanted to resolve it. We will plan the final resolution at the next teleconference meeting. NEXT MEETING: The next IBIS Meeting will be the IBIS Summit Meeting at DesignCon in San Jose, CA on Monday, January 29, 2001 from 8:30 AM to 5:00 PM. There will not be any teleconference connection. The next teleconference meeting will be on Friday at a date to be determined from 8:00 AM to 10:00 AM. BIRD65.2 and BIRD68.1 are scheduled for a vote. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897 bob_ross@mentor.com Modeling Engineer, Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070 VICE CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-4515 stephen.peters@intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF1-209 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, OR 97124-5961 SECRETARY: Guy de Burgh (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 gdeburgh@innoveda.com Senior Manager, Innoveda 1369 Del Norte Rd. Camarillo, CA 93010-8437 LIBRARIAN: Roy Leventhal (837) 797-2152, Fax: (847) 222-2799 roy_leventhal@3com.com Senior Engineer, CommWorks Corp. (a wholly owned 3Com subsidiary) 1800 W. Central Rd. Mt. Prospect, IL 60056-2293 WEBMASTER: Syed Huq (408) 525-3399, Fax: (408) 526-5504 shuq@cisco.com Manager, Hardware Engineering, Cisco Systems 170 West Tasman Drive San Jose, CA 95134-1706 POSTMASTER: John Angulo (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008 jangulo@innoveda.com Development Engineer, HyperLynx, Inc. 14715 N.E. 95th Street, Suite 200 Redmond, WA 98052 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@eda.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@eda.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@eda.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@eda.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@eda.org To report ibischk2/3 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt, /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, & /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eigroup.org/ibis/ibis.htm Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. ============================================================================== From owner-ibis Tue Jan 9 15:46:05 2001 Received: from natsemi-bh.nsc.com (natsemi-bh.nsc.com [204.163.202.66]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f09Nk3j14691 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:46:05 -0800 (PST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by natsemi-bh.nsc.com (8.8.8/8.6.11) id PAA24646 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:42:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmh1.nsc.com(139.187.179.130) by natsemi-bh.nsc.com via smap (4.1) id xma024032; Tue, 9 Jan 01 15:40:32 -0800 Received: from galaxy.nsc.com by scmh1.nsc.com with ESMTP for ibis@eda.org; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:40:18 -0800 Received: from xi.nsc.com (xi.nsc.com [139.187.209.24]) by galaxy.nsc.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA20391 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:40:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from schwartz@localhost) by xi.nsc.com (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) id PAA05588 for ibis@eda.org; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:40:31 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:40:31 -0800 (PST) From: Milt Schwartz x3261 Message-Id: <200101092340.PAA05588@xi.nsc.com> To: ibis@eda.org Subject: IBIS Summit 3rd Announcement X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DESIGNCON 2001 THIRD IBIS SUMMIT CALL FOR PARTICIPATION, PRESENTATIONS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I B I S S U M M I T M E E T I N G Time/Date: 8:00 PM - 5:00 PM, Monday, January 29, 2001 Location: Santa Clara Convention Center Santa Clara, CA Content: IBIS Future Requirements is the main topic of this meeting These include an exchange of ideas on IBIS accuracy, connectors, and new requirements under discussion. Purpose: Solicit and Exchange IBIS Model Related Information and Ideas. Sponsors: DesignCon 2001 & National Semiconductor Corporation IBIS Summit Signup: Milt Schwartz schwartz@galaxy.nsc.com D E S I G N C O N 2 0 0 0 M E E T I N G S Time/Date: Monday - Thursday, January 29 - February 1, 2001 Exhibition: Tuesday - Wednesday, 12:30 PM - 6:30 PM, January 30-31, 2001 IBIS Booth: #861, Exhibition Hall - IBIS Information URL DesignCon2001: http://www.designcon.com/ CALL FOR IBIS SUMMIT PRESENTATIONS We already have several presentations and discussion topics planned. However, we are also seeking presentations from individuals who have IBIS experiences or issues. Format of Presentation: Overhead Projections Time: 15-30 Minutes Electronic Archival: We request electronic versions so that the presentations can be archived and also made available to non-attendees. Formats used in the past have been text, Power Point, Word, Postscript, and Acrobat. If you cannot provide an electronic format, then plan to bring 50 copies for distribution at the meeting. If you plan a presentation, please supply Title: Presenter: E-mail address: Company: Telephone: Estimate Time: Send this to: Milt Schwartz schwartz@galaxy.nsc.com Deadline: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 for receiving presentations for copying. AGENDA The agenda includes presentations, discussions, refreshments, and a free buffet luncheon for participants. In addition, we will have an opportunity for Ad Hoc presentations and extended discussions. Tentatively we plan the following topics (titles may change): "The Joy of Downloaded Models", Tom Dagostino, Mentor Graphics "Spice 2 IBIS Accuracy Report", Scott McMorrow, Siqual "LVDS Buffer Modeling", Hazem Hegany and Mohammed Korany, Mentor Graphics "Modeling Approach for Pre-emphasis Buffers", Hazem Hegeny and Mohammed Korny, Mentor Graphics "Connector Specification Discussion", Gus Panella, Molex "SCSI-3 Compensation Modeling" Larry Barnes, LSI Logic "IBIS Futures and Discussion", Stephen Peters, Intel "IBIS-X Prototype", Al Davis, Consultant From owner-ibis Wed Jan 10 13:35:31 2001 Received: from easystreet01.easystreet.com (easystreet.com [206.26.36.40]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0ALZSj19691 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 13:35:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from C541536A (dial-206-102-3-46.easystreet.com [206.102.3.46]) by easystreet01.easystreet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA25209; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 13:31:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <00bb01c07b4d$111b3d70$fd96fea9@C541536A> Reply-To: "Dima Smolyansky" From: "Dima Smolyansky" To: "Milt Schwartz x3261" , References: <200101092340.PAA05588@xi.nsc.com> Subject: Re: IBIS Summit 3rd Announcement Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 13:32:21 -0800 Organization: TDA Systems, Inc. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 Milt: There will be two people from TDA Systems present - Dima Smolyansky and Steven Corey. Please let me know if you need additional sign up information. -Thanks, =================== Dima Smolyansky TDA Systems, Inc. 11140 SW Barbur Blvd., Suite 100 Portland, OR 97219 (503) 246-2272 (503) 246-2282 (fax) (503) 804-7171 (mobile) http://www.tdasystems.com The Interconnect Modeling Company(TM) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Milt Schwartz x3261" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2001 3:40 PM Subject: IBIS Summit 3rd Announcement > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > --------------------------------------------------------------------- - > DESIGNCON 2001 THIRD IBIS SUMMIT CALL FOR PARTICIPATION, PRESENTATIONS > --------------------------------------------------------------------- - > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > I B I S S U M M I T M E E T I N G > > Time/Date: 8:00 PM - 5:00 PM, Monday, January 29, 2001 > > Location: Santa Clara Convention Center > Santa Clara, CA > > Content: IBIS Future Requirements is the main topic of this meeting > These include an exchange of ideas on IBIS accuracy, > connectors, and new requirements under discussion. > > Purpose: Solicit and Exchange IBIS Model Related Information and Ideas. > > Sponsors: DesignCon 2001 & National Semiconductor Corporation > > IBIS Summit Signup: > Milt Schwartz > schwartz@galaxy.nsc.com > > > D E S I G N C O N 2 0 0 0 M E E T I N G S > > Time/Date: Monday - Thursday, January 29 - February 1, 2001 > > Exhibition: Tuesday - Wednesday, 12:30 PM - 6:30 PM, January 30-31, 2001 > > IBIS Booth: #861, Exhibition Hall > - IBIS Information > > URL DesignCon2001: > http://www.designcon.com/ > > > CALL FOR IBIS SUMMIT PRESENTATIONS > > We already have several presentations and discussion topics planned. However, > we are also seeking presentations from individuals who have IBIS experiences > or issues. > > Format of Presentation: Overhead Projections > Time: 15-30 Minutes > Electronic Archival: We request electronic versions so that the > presentations can be archived and also made > available to non-attendees. Formats used in > the past have been text, Power Point, Word, > Postscript, and Acrobat. If you cannot provide > an electronic format, then plan to bring 50 > copies for distribution at the meeting. > > > If you plan a presentation, please supply > > Title: > Presenter: > E-mail address: > Company: > Telephone: > > Estimate Time: > > Send this to: > > Milt Schwartz > schwartz@galaxy.nsc.com > > Deadline: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 for receiving presentations for > copying. > > > AGENDA > > The agenda includes presentations, discussions, refreshments, and a free > buffet luncheon for participants. In addition, we will have an opportunity > for Ad Hoc presentations and extended discussions. Tentatively we plan the > following topics (titles may change): > > "The Joy of Downloaded Models", Tom Dagostino, Mentor Graphics > "Spice 2 IBIS Accuracy Report", Scott McMorrow, Siqual > "LVDS Buffer Modeling", Hazem Hegany and Mohammed Korany, Mentor Graphics > "Modeling Approach for Pre-emphasis Buffers", Hazem Hegeny and > Mohammed Korny, Mentor Graphics > "Connector Specification Discussion", Gus Panella, Molex > "SCSI-3 Compensation Modeling" Larry Barnes, LSI Logic > "IBIS Futures and Discussion", Stephen Peters, Intel > "IBIS-X Prototype", Al Davis, Consultant > From owner-ibis Fri Jan 12 07:22:35 2001 Received: from mail2.iec.org (mail.iec.org [216.172.108.120]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0CFMWj28145 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 07:22:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by MAIL2 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:37:54 -0600 Message-ID: <90F13E4F338DD3119CAD009027CC8297011881A1@MAIL2> From: David Erickson To: "'ibis@eda.org'" Subject: Your free E-PASS for DesignCon 2001! Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:37:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Here is your free E-PASS for complimentary exhibits-only registration at DesignCon 2001 **PLUS*** you can attend the Keynote and Plenary sessions for free. See the latest electronic design technologies and services from more than 130 exhibitors on the DesignCon 2001 exhibit floor-the largest exhibit floor to date! Simply complete the form at the end of the page and bring it to the Santa Clara Convention Center, or go directly to www.designcon.com/2001/register.asp. Register now and qualify to win one of two Palm Pilots given away each week! Attend the IBIS SUMMIT: Monday January 29, 2001 8:30 AM to 5 PM. To register for the summit, contact Milt Schwartz at schwartz@galaxy.nsc.com. ********************************************************************** DesignCon 2001 Conference: January 29 - February 1 Exhibits: January 30-31 Santa Clara Convention Center, Santa Clara California ********************************************************************* Congratulations to last week's Palm Pilot winners: Chie Lie Wang, 3COM and John Thomas, Broadcom Attend DesignCon 2001, the design-engineering industry's premier conference and exhibition-located right in Silicon Valley. View the exhibits on January 30-31, at the Santa Clara Convention Center, Santa Clara, California. Visit www.designcon.com for complete details, or view the complete exhibitor list at www.designcon.com/2001/exhlist.asp. Exhibits The exhibits at DesignCon 2001 provide attendees with a firsthand look at the latest technologies and solutions available. More than 100 companies will present their technologies and provide all the solutions you need. Here are some of the products and demonstrations you will find on the DesignCon exhibit floor: Applications Engineering ASICs Components Analog/RF Engineering Computer Software and Peripherals Design Automation Tools EDA/CAE Tools FPGAs Interconnection Devices Packaging PLDs Semiconductors Standard, Analog, Mixed-Signal, Digital, and Memory ICs System Boards Test, Measurement, and Debug Tools Interested in the DesignCon Sessions? View or download the entire conference catalog at www.designcon.com/2001/catalog.pdf . Experience the DesignCon difference! Exhibit and Demonstration Hours Tuesday, January 30 12:30 pm - 6:30 pm Wednesday, January 31 12:30 pm - 6:00 pm VISIT DESIGNCON EXHIBITORS ON THE WEB! www.designcon.com/2001/exhlist.asp . Please print this form and fill in the following information to complete your registration. Return fax to +1-312-559-4111 or email to designcon@iec.org. Name: _____________________________________________ E-Mail: _____________________________________________ Badge: ____________________________________________ Title: ______________________________________________ Company: __________________________________________ Division: ___________________________________________ Address: ___________________________________________ __________________________________________________ City, State, Zip: _____________________________________ __________________________________________________ Country: ___________________________________________ Office Phone: _______________________________________ Office Fax: _________________________________________ FAX THIS FORM TO +1-312-559-4111, OR BRING IT TO THE SANTA CLARA CONVENTION CENTER JANUARY 30-31. Or Email to designcon@iec.org. For more information call a the DesignCon team at 1-888-486-8736. From owner-ibis Fri Jan 12 15:58:13 2001 Received: from mako.hhnetwk.com (mail.hammerheadnetworks.com [64.55.108.178]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0CNwBj29895 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:58:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from hhnetwk.com (mlabonte.hhnetwk.com [10.2.4.53]) by mako.hhnetwk.com (8.11.0/bg-001114) with ESMTP id f0CNsMm23856 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:54:22 -0500 Message-ID: <3A5F996E.7B6240A9@hhnetwk.com> Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:55:26 -0500 From: Mike LaBonte X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IBIS Users Subject: s2ibis2 issues Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, One would think I would know the answers by now, but... 1) Has anyone used s2ibis2 to convert 1.5V logic? I had to fix it because it was putting bogus points near the ends of thepullup and pulldown VI curves. 2) Why does s2ibis2 run waveform simulations with 100 points, then resample them down to 51 points for output to the IBIS file, when the IBIS spec allows 100 points? The resampled waveform even has a time lag with respect to the original. Since s2ibis2 has been used to create many IBIS models since it was last updated in August 1998, one would assume that it is producing fairly good results, once one learns to use it. But I find these issues and others, too. Has every working copy out there been modified like mine? Mike LaBonte From owner-ibis Fri Jan 12 16:26:51 2001 Received: from emu.prod.itd.earthlink.net (emu.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.121.31]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0D0Qlj29970 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:26:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from rosebud.al.dynip.com (dialup-209.245.171.110.Seattle1.Level3.net [209.245.171.110]) by emu.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3-EL_1_3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA00962; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:22:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from hobbes ([192.168.22.7]) by rosebud.al.dynip.com (8.10.2/8.10.2/SuSE Linux 8.10.0-0.3) with SMTP id f0D0NAU10880; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:23:10 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: rosebud.al.dynip.com: Host [192.168.22.7] claimed to be hobbes From: Al Davis To: Mike LaBonte , IBIS Users Subject: Re: s2ibis2 issues Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:22:53 -0800 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.1.61] Content-Type: text/plain References: <3A5F996E.7B6240A9@hhnetwk.com> In-Reply-To: <3A5F996E.7B6240A9@hhnetwk.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01011216225305.01647@hobbes> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Fri, 12 Jan 2001, Mike LaBonte wrote: > 2) Why does s2ibis2 run waveform simulations with 100 points, > then resample them down to 51 points for output to the IBIS > file, when the IBIS spec allows 100 points? The resampled > waveform even has a time lag with respect to the original. Here's my guess: They were planning to add an algorithm to do smart point selection, but the student graduated and no-one else picked up the work. From owner-ibis Fri Jan 12 19:33:08 2001 Received: from ptldpop5.ptld.uswest.net ([198.36.160.5]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with SMTP id f0D3X7j00330 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:33:07 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 94683 invoked by alias); 13 Jan 2001 03:29:26 -0000 Delivered-To: fixup-ibis@eda.org@fixme Received: (qmail 94674 invoked by uid 0); 13 Jan 2001 03:29:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vasthorizons.com) (63.225.95.1) by 198.36.160.5 with SMTP; 13 Jan 2001 03:29:26 -0000 Message-ID: <3A5FCB95.D465B7DE@vasthorizons.com> Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:29:25 -0800 From: Scott McMorrow Organization: SiQual X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mike LaBonte CC: IBIS Users Subject: Re: s2ibis2 issues References: <3A5F996E.7B6240A9@hhnetwk.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike, 1) Yes, it puts in bogus points. We just delete them. 2) Good question. I modified the code to simulate with 250 points. This is available in s2ibis2fix. We resample down to 100 points with an external algorithm. 3) We also modified the code to run on Windows NT and 2000 with HSpice, and increased the number of significant digits being printed in the tables, also. Welcome to the club. regards, scott -- Scott McMorrow Principal Engineer SiQual, Signal Quality Engineering 18735 SW Boones Ferry Road Tualatin, OR 97062-3090 (503) 885-1231 http://www.siqual.com Mike LaBonte wrote: > Hello, > > One would think I would know the answers by now, but... > > 1) Has anyone used s2ibis2 to convert 1.5V logic? I had to fix it > because it was putting bogus points near the ends of thepullup > and pulldown VI curves. > > 2) Why does s2ibis2 run waveform simulations with 100 points, > then resample them down to 51 points for output to the IBIS > file, when the IBIS spec allows 100 points? The resampled > waveform even has a time lag with respect to the original. > > Since s2ibis2 has been used to create many IBIS models since it > was last updated in August 1998, one would assume that it is > producing fairly good results, once one learns to use it. But I > find these issues and others, too. Has every working copy out > there been modified like mine? > > Mike LaBonte From owner-ibis Thu Jan 18 07:26:42 2001 Received: from mailgate2.Cadence.COM (mailgate2.Cadence.COM [158.140.2.31]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0IFQej04789 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 07:26:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from gda.Cadence.COM (gda.Cadence.COM [158.140.106.10]) by mailgate2.Cadence.COM (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA24190 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 07:22:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from cadence.com (d158140105215 [158.140.105.215]) by gda.Cadence.COM (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA21593 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:22:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3A670A35.A369955D@cadence.com> Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:22:29 -0500 From: Ian Dodd Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ibis reflector Subject: Clarification question for threshold parameters Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Received: By mailgate2.Cadence.COM as HAA24190 at Thu Jan 18 07:22:56 2001 All, Unless I have missed something, the IBIS spec seems unclear as to what parameters are valid on what types of model. For example is Vmeas valid for an output type? Did I miss something, and if not, have we discussed this problem? Thanks Ian Dodd idodd@cadence.com From owner-ibis Thu Jan 18 22:49:49 2001 Received: from penguin.prod.itd.earthlink.net (penguin.prod.itd.earthlink.net [207.217.120.134]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0J6nmj08278 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:49:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from rosebud.al.dynip.com (dialup-209.245.160.142.Seattle1.Level3.net [209.245.160.142]) by penguin.prod.itd.earthlink.net (8.9.3-EL_1_3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA04583; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:46:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from hobbes ([192.168.22.7]) by rosebud.al.dynip.com (8.10.2/8.10.2/SuSE Linux 8.10.0-0.3) with SMTP id f0J6kTU29213; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:46:29 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: rosebud.al.dynip.com: Host [192.168.22.7] claimed to be hobbes From: Al Davis To: Ian Dodd , ibis reflector Subject: Re: Clarification question for threshold parameters Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:46:09 -0800 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.1.61] Content-Type: text/plain References: <3A670A35.A369955D@cadence.com> In-Reply-To: <3A670A35.A369955D@cadence.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01011822460904.31145@hobbes> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Thu, 18 Jan 2001, Ian Dodd wrote: > Unless I have missed something, the IBIS spec seems unclear > as to what parameters are valid on what types of model. Correct. > For example is Vmeas valid for an output type? 1. Some models use it, and the parser doesn't reject it. 2. It is useful for mixed-mode (mixed A & D) simulators, when the output node is interpreted as a digital node. > Did I miss something, and if not, have we discussed this problem? As far as I know, it has not come up before. I ran into it working on the IBIS-X standard macro file, and attempting to interface the IBIS-X translator to a mixed-mode simulator (ACS). So, it looks like the answer is YES. I assumed it was NO, and got in trouble for it. al. From owner-ibis Fri Jan 19 09:43:06 2001 Received: from relay1.wv.mentorg.com (relay1.mentorg.com [192.94.38.42]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0JHh4j10925 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 09:43:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com by relay1.wv.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id JAA19275; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 09:39:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 09:39:05 -0800 Message-ID: <2179BC5B6583D311B44700508B44146902B8A956@svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com> From: "Dagostino, Tom" To: "'Al Davis'" , Ian Dodd , ibis reflector Subject: RE: Clarification question for threshold parameters Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 09:39:04 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I thought Vmeas is only for outputs. It is the voltage reference for timing measurements under the manufacturers recommended load (Cref, Rref, Vref). Tom Dagostino IBIS and Tau Modeling Manager SDD Mentor Graphics Corp. 503-685-1613 tom_dagostino@mentor.com -----Original Message----- From: Al Davis [mailto:aldavis@ieee.org] Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 10:46 PM To: Ian Dodd; ibis reflector Subject: Re: Clarification question for threshold parameters On Thu, 18 Jan 2001, Ian Dodd wrote: > Unless I have missed something, the IBIS spec seems unclear > as to what parameters are valid on what types of model. Correct. > For example is Vmeas valid for an output type? 1. Some models use it, and the parser doesn't reject it. 2. It is useful for mixed-mode (mixed A & D) simulators, when the output node is interpreted as a digital node. > Did I miss something, and if not, have we discussed this problem? As far as I know, it has not come up before. I ran into it working on the IBIS-X standard macro file, and attempting to interface the IBIS-X translator to a mixed-mode simulator (ACS). So, it looks like the answer is YES. I assumed it was NO, and got in trouble for it. al. From owner-ibis Fri Jan 19 14:41:23 2001 Received: from ptldpop5.ptld.uswest.net ([198.36.160.5]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with SMTP id f0JMfKj12293 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 14:41:22 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 70734 invoked by alias); 19 Jan 2001 22:37:35 -0000 Delivered-To: fixup-ibis@vhdl.org@fixme Received: (qmail 70686 invoked by uid 0); 19 Jan 2001 22:37:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vasthorizons.com) (63.225.95.1) by 198.36.160.5 with SMTP; 19 Jan 2001 22:37:34 -0000 Message-ID: <3A68C1AF.DC53E958@vasthorizons.com> Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 14:37:35 -0800 From: Scott McMorrow Organization: SiQual X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dagostino, Tom" CC: "'Al Davis'" , Ian Dodd , ibis reflector Subject: Re: Clarification question for threshold parameters References: <2179BC5B6583D311B44700508B44146902B8A956@svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tom, You are correct. scott "Dagostino, Tom" wrote: > I thought Vmeas is only for outputs. It is the voltage reference for timing > measurements under the manufacturers recommended load (Cref, Rref, Vref). > > Tom Dagostino > IBIS and Tau Modeling Manager > SDD > Mentor Graphics Corp. > 503-685-1613 > tom_dagostino@mentor.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Al Davis [mailto:aldavis@ieee.org] > Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 10:46 PM > To: Ian Dodd; ibis reflector > Subject: Re: Clarification question for threshold parameters > > On Thu, 18 Jan 2001, Ian Dodd wrote: > > Unless I have missed something, the IBIS spec seems unclear > > as to what parameters are valid on what types of model. > > Correct. > > > For example is Vmeas valid for an output type? > > 1. Some models use it, and the parser doesn't reject it. > > 2. It is useful for mixed-mode (mixed A & D) simulators, when the > output node is interpreted as a digital node. > > > Did I miss something, and if not, have we discussed this problem? > > As far as I know, it has not come up before. I ran into it working > on the IBIS-X standard macro file, and attempting to interface the > IBIS-X translator to a mixed-mode simulator (ACS). > > So, it looks like the answer is YES. I assumed it was NO, and got in > trouble for it. > > al. -- Scott McMorrow Principal Engineer SiQual, Signal Quality Engineering 18735 SW Boones Ferry Road Tualatin, OR 97062-3090 (503) 885-1231 http://www.siqual.com From owner-ibis Mon Jan 22 11:55:13 2001 Received: from relay1.wv.mentorg.com (relay1.mentorg.com [192.94.38.42]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0MJtBH10020; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:55:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com by relay1.wv.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id LAA02729; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:51:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from mentor.com (bob.wv.mentorg.com [147.34.83.63]) by svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id CY61B4RC; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:51:22 -0800 Sender: bobr@relay1.mentorg.com Message-ID: <3A6C8F39.3B2C9875@mentor.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:51:21 -0800 From: Bob Ross X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ibis@eda.org, ibis-users@eda.org Subject: IBIS SUMMIT MEETING AGENDA 1/29/01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To IBIS Summit Attendees: If you have not done so already, please let Milt Schwartz know if you are attending: schwartz@galaxy.nsc.com People who are presenting: please send the presentations to Milt for copying at the above address. Otherwise, plan to bring 50 copies for distribution at the meeting. We will have an overhead slide projector and also a projector for laptop presentations. I prefer using slides, if practical, to maximize interaction during discussions and for Ad Hoc presentations. Bob Ross Mentor Graphics ------------------------------------------------------------------ AGENDA, IBIS SUMMIT MEETING JANUARY 29, 2001 Westin Hotel Santa Clara Convention Center Santa Clara, California Check Signs for Meeting Room ------------------------------------------------------------------ 8:00 AM Refreshments & Sign In 8:30 AM Introductions - Welcome to Summit - Introductions - IBIS Booth #861 Placards - IBIS Program - Bob Ross, Mentor Graphics - Opens for Issues, Discussion 9:00 AM The Joy of Web Models Tom Dagostino, Mentor Graphics 9:30 AM Spice 2 IBIS Accuracy Report Scott McMorrow, Siqual 10:00 AM Break 10:15 AM LVDS Buffer Modeling Hazem Hegany and Mohammed Korany, Mentor Graphics 10:45 AM LSI Power and Ground Model for EMI Simulation Norio Matsui, Applied Simulation Technology 11:15 AM SCSI-3 Compensation Modeling Larry Barnes, LSI Logic 12:00 PM Lunch - (Hosted by National Semiconductor) Westin Hotel 1:00 PM API Questions and Issues Al Davis, Consultant 1:30 PM Connector Specification Gus Panella, Molex 1:45 PM Connector Pin Name Syntax Ian Dodd, Cadence 2:00 PM Connector Specification Discussion Gus Panella, Molex 2:30 PM Break 2:45 PM IBIS Futures Stephen Peters, Intel 3:00 PM IBIS-X Prototype Al Davis, Consultant 3:15 PM IBIS Futures Discussion Stephen Peters, Intel 3:45 AM Open Discussion and Ad Hoc Topics All 4:45 PM Concluding Items - Date2000 IBIS Summit - Next Meeting February 16, 2001 - ?? 5:00 PM End of IBIS Summit Meeting ------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-ibis Thu Jan 25 08:02:58 2001 Received: from chntva1-smrly1.gtei.net (chntva1-smrly1.gtei.net [128.11.152.196]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0PG2uH25251 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:02:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from fairchild-cp.fairchildsemi.com (fairchild-cp.fairchildsemi.com [192.233.132.79]) by chntva1-smrly1.gtei.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 48DE44867 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:58:59 +0000 (GMT) Received: FROM fairchildsemi.com BY hqnttest01.fairchildsemi.com ; Thu Jan 25 10:56:04 2001 -0800 Received: from spor02.fairchildsemi.com by fairchildsemi.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA08870; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:57:37 -0500 Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON by spf.fairchildsemi.com (PMDF V5.2-33 #43442) id <01JZBLKRJCLCHL41P5@spf.fairchildsemi.com>; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:59:46 EST Received: from fairchildsemi.com (cklein-fm.fairchildsemi.com [172.21.64.63]) by spf.fairchildsemi.com (PMDF V5.2-33 #34675) with ESMTP id <01JZBLKRC3V0GZVJAV@spf.fairchildsemi.com>; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:59:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:58:54 -0500 From: Christian Klein Subject: unsubscribe To: ibis@eda.org Message-id: <3A704D3E.854C155A@fairchildsemi.com> Organization: Fairchild Semiconductor MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_f+Tuf/zscbJ+uovD37o/iA)" X-Accept-Language: en,pt-BR References: <200005260303.IAA18200@corona.cadence.com> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_f+Tuf/zscbJ+uovD37o/iA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit unsubscribe --Boundary_(ID_f+Tuf/zscbJ+uovD37o/iA) Content-type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="Christian.Klein.vcf" Content-description: Card for Christian Klein Content-disposition: attachment; filename="Christian.Klein.vcf" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit begin:vcard n:Klein;Christian tel;fax:(207) 775-8774 tel;work:(207) 761-6242 x-mozilla-html:TRUE org:;Interface & Logic Division version:2.1 email;internet:Christian.Klein@fairchildsemi.com title:Design Engineer adr;quoted-printable:;;82 Running Hill Road=0D=0AM-S 35-2H;South Portland;ME;04106;USA fn:Christian Klein end:vcard --Boundary_(ID_f+Tuf/zscbJ+uovD37o/iA)-- From owner-ibis Thu Jan 25 09:46:59 2001 Received: from relay1.wv.mentorg.com (relay1.mentorg.com [192.94.38.42]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0PHkuH25701; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:46:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com by relay1.wv.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id JAA26098; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:43:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mentor.com (bob.wv.mentorg.com [147.34.83.63]) by svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id CY61B8F1; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:43:02 -0800 Sender: bobr@relay1.mentorg.com Message-ID: <3A7065A5.DC29A55E@mentor.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:43:01 -0800 From: Bob Ross X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ibis@eda.org, ibis-users@eda.org, si-list@silab.eng.sun.com Subject: EUROPEAN IBIS SUMMIT MEETING ANNOUNCEMENT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To All: We have been holding successful European IBIS Summit Meetings for the last three years. This year we are again holding a meeting along with DATE 2001 on Friday, March 16, 2001. The purpose is to promote communication among users and developers of IBIS models in Europe. The meeting is free and open to everyone. Refreshments and a hot lunch will be provided to all attendees. Below is some information on the IBIS Summit and some related events. You are invited to register and also to submit presentation proposals. We already have three or four presentations. Bob Ross Mentor Graphics E U R O P E A N I B I S S U M M I T M E E T I N G F I R S T A N N O U N C E M E N T Time/Date: 8:30 PM - 5:00 PM, Friday, March 16, 2001 Location: ASTRON HOTEL/Neue Messe Eggenfeldener Strasse 100 Munich, Germany This hotel is near the DATE 2001 Conference Content: Presentations and Discussions Purpose: Solicit and Exchange IBIS Model Related Information and Ideas Sponsors: Cadence Design, Innoveda, Mentor Graphics, Zuken DATE 2001: March 13 - 16, 2001. The IBIS meeting is scheduled the day after the DATE 2001 exhibition ends. Location: International Congress Center, Munich, Germany See http://www.date-conference.com for more information. BACKGROUND We have been holding interesting European IBIS Summit Meetings for the last three years. This year we are planning another meeting to include: Submitted Presentations on IBIS Topics (See below) Information about IBIS Version 3.2 and Activities Less formal Ad Hoc Presentations and Discussions IBIS Questions and Answers Below is an invitation to register and also to submit presentations. CALL FOR PARTICIPANTS People involved in IBIS Model development, EDA tool development, and digital circuit design are invited to participate in the European IBIS Summit meeting. If you plan to participate, please register with the information below (deadline, March 9, 2001): Name: E-mail address: Company: Telephone: Send to: Karine Loudet (karine_loudet@mentor.com) +33 1 40 94 74 54 CALL FOR PRESENTATIONS We are seeking presentations from individuals who have IBIS experiences or issues. Some suggested subjects of interest are: IBIS Model Development Experiences Company IBIS Standards and Requirements Generating and Validating IBIS Models Future IBIS Requirements EMC/EMI IBIS Issues Format of Presentation: Overhead Projections Time: 15-30 Minutes Electronic Archival: We request electronic versions so that the presentations can be archived and also made available to non-attendees. Formats used in the past have been text, Power Point, Word, Postscript, and Acrobat. Electronic presentations should be made available by March 6, 2001. Otherwise the presentor will be expected to provide 50 copies for distribution. If you plan a presentation, please supply Title: Presenter: E-mail address: Company: Telephone: Estimate Time: Send this to: Karine Loudet (karine_loudet@mentor.com) Bob Ross (bob_ross@mentor.com) AGENDA The agenda includes presentations, discussions. A free lunch is scheduled for all attendees. FOR FURTHER INFORMATION: Bob Ross, Chair, EIA/IBIS Open Forum Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road Wilsonville, Oregon 97070 USA (503) 685-0732 bob_ross@mentor.com From owner-ibis Thu Jan 25 09:31:41 2001 Received: from relay1.wv.mentorg.com (relay1.mentorg.com [192.94.38.42]) by server.eda.org (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f0PHVdH25652; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:31:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com by relay1.wv.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id JAA24024; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:27:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mentor.com (bob.wv.mentorg.com [147.34.83.63]) by svr-orw-exc-02.wv.mentorg.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id CY61B8C3; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:27:47 -0800 Sender: bobr@relay1.mentorg.com Message-ID: <3A706211.9A4853FB@mentor.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:27:45 -0800 From: Bob Ross X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ibis@eda.org, ibis-users@eda.org Subject: Revised IBIS AGENDA 1/29/01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To IBIS Summit Meeting Attendees: This is a slightly revised Agenda with some time adjustments, order and content adjustments. We expect a full program, so presentors please plan to stay within the time limits. A new work in progress connector specification Version 0.960 has been uploaded in http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/connector/ Looking forward to seeing you at the meeting. Bob Ross, Mentor Graphics ------------------------------------------------------------------ AGENDA, IBIS SUMMIT MEETING JANUARY 29, 2001 Westin Hotel Santa Clara Convention Center Santa Clara, California Check Signs for Meeting Room ------------------------------------------------------------------ 8:00 AM Refreshments & Sign In 8:30 AM Introductions - Welcome to Summit - Introductions - IBIS Booth #861 Placards - IBIS Today - Bob Ross, Mentor Graphics - Opens for Issues, Discussion 9:00 AM The Joy of Web Models Tom Dagostino, Mentor Graphics 9:30 AM Spice 2 IBIS Accuracy Report Scott McMorrow, Siqual 10:00 AM Break 10:15 AM LVDS Modeling Hazem Hegany and Mohammed Korany, Mentor Graphics 11:00 AM LSI Power and Ground Model for EMI Simulation Norio Matsui, Applied Simulation Technology 11:30 AM SCSI-3 Compensation Modeling Larry Barnes, LSI Logic 12:00 PM Lunch - (Hosted by National Semiconductor) Westin Hotel 1:00 PM Connector Specification Gus Panella, Molex 1:15 PM Connector Pin Name Syntax Ian Dodd, Cadence 1:30 PM Connector Specification Discussion Gus Panella, Molex 2:00 PM API Questions and Issues Al Davis, Consultant 2:30 PM Break 2:45 PM IBIS Futures Stephen Peters, Intel 3:00 PM IBIS-X Technical Overview Ian Dodd, Cadence 3:15 PM IBIS-X Prototype Al Davis, Consultant 3:30 PM IBIS-X Pros and Cons Ian Dodd, Cadence 3:45 PM IBIS Futures Discussion Stephen Peters, Intel 4:15 PM Open Discussion and Ad Hoc Topics All 4:45 PM Concluding Items - Date2000 IBIS Summit - Next Meeting February 16, 2001 5:00 PM End of IBIS Summit Meeting ------------------------------------------------------------------